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  1. #61
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    Quote Originally Posted by Toxic Waltz View Post
    Atheism is believing in something when there is "enough proof".

    examples:
    2+2=4

    Religion is making up proof.

    examples:
    Bible
    So what's the atheist theory of how the universe started? Big Bang Theory? If that is the case, then let me tell you we're moving away from it. The Big Bang is finding more scientists in disagreement because the evidence is turning against it. Like many old paradigms, it still has its zealous adherents. But more scientists (not only creation scientists but secular cosmologists as well) are seeing data which does not fit it well. So, the direction in science is not towards the Big Bang but away from it - or at least, there is an acknowledgment that it doesn't fit some of the latest data. Of course the failure of the Big Bang to explain all the data will not lead to a rush toward creationism or intelligent design. The Big Bang theory itself will be drastically revised or it will be abandoned in favor of another theory which also fits with the long-age evolutionary paradigm.

    Quote Originally Posted by BustaRap View Post
    -Dictionary.com (search "normal")

    The 'normal' explanation of how the universe was created is the Big Bang Theory. In addition to this, Einstein's theory of general relativity, quantum mechanics, and string theory (confounded by many scientists, not just Einstein) explain how everything works at the smallest to the largest levels of existence.

    Read a non-ficticious book once in a while my good sir, .

    ---------------



    You really want me to prove to you that when the heart stops, blood no longer flows?

    1. Ask any doctor numb nuts.
    2. Cut your own throat, see what happens ()
    3. Tie a string tightly around your upper arm, see what happens to the lower part.
    4. Touch the skin above your heart... (doesn't work with fatties lawl)

    And besides, which is more likely:
    A) When you "die" your soul (which no doctor or coroner has ever found physical evidence of) magically is uprooted from your body, floats either up or down, and somehow that "soul" is able to experience everything that your body could (touch, taste, smell, etc.)

    B) Maggots eat your dead body, and you are decomposed in other ways by organisms in the earth. And since you no longer have life, your bodily fluids drain away/evaporate and you turn into dust, dirt, and maggot excrement.

    Btw, if you choose A), then you don't believe in gas/oil. Gtfo my gas station pl0x.
    How does that even prove there's no after-life? Ever heard of the term 'soul'? Prove to me that humans don't have souls. Prove to me how you know that your conscious state ceases to exist after dying. Oh wait- you can't, because you'd have to die in order to find out. I do not say that after you die, you don't stop living (common sense for fuck's sake), but where do you even think the expression after-life comes from?

    Recalling your naming of the Big Bang Theory, do you have any theory on why or how did this happen? What even caused it? No. So it could be anything (including a superior deity in which you obviously don't believe or have no interest on thinking about it).
    God is great, beer is good, and people are crazy.

  2. #62
    Maddoc's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by natiko View Post

    How does that even prove there's no after-life? Ever heard of the term 'soul'? Prove to me that humans don't have souls. Prove to me how you know that your conscious state ceases to exist after dying. Oh wait- you can't, because you'd have to die in order to find out. I do not say that after you die, you don't stop living (common sense for fuck's sake), but where do you even think the expression after-life comes from?

    Recalling your naming of the Big Bang Theory, do you have any theory on why or how did this happen? What even caused it? No. So it could be anything (including a superior deity in which you obviously don't believe or have no interest on thinking about it).
    Irrelevent: Giners dont have souls <3

    Relevent: Don't you think that, after THOUSANDS of years, there would have been atleast ONE case of them reaching out to us? And don't consider "ghosts", as theyd be here on the mortal "plane", if they existed, not in heaven or hell.

    Also, while I absolutely HATE to say this, because I find it a stupid way to comeback, prove to me souls DO exist and go to heaven/hell. Because, if they DO exist, ok, cool, now how does having a soul have something to do with "god"?

    If "god" created this world, thats fine and dandy, but what if theres no heaven or hell? What if we just end up going to this, sortof airplane type thing, where you go through this time of unconciousness then end up being met by all your ancestors wavin at you like "HEY, HOW HAPPETH IT UP INETH THIS BITCH?!" and you just keep "living", but your dead.

    Kinda weird I know lol.

  3. #63
    Toxic Waltz's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by natiko View Post
    So what's the atheist theory of how the universe started? Big Bang Theory? If that is the case, then let me tell you we're moving away from it. The Big Bang is finding more scientists in disagreement because the evidence is turning against it. Like many old paradigms, it still has its zealous adherents. But more scientists (not only creation scientists but secular cosmologists as well) are seeing data which does not fit it well. So, the direction in science is not towards the Big Bang but away from it - or at least, there is an acknowledgment that it doesn't fit some of the latest data. Of course the failure of the Big Bang to explain all the data will not lead to a rush toward creationism or intelligent design. The Big Bang theory itself will be drastically revised or it will be abandoned in favor of another theory which also fits with the long-age evolutionary paradigm.
    I have never understood the concept of nothing creating nothing and never really liked the big bang theory. Although there is proof the universe is expanding I don't know any other proof and therefore I don't acknowledge the big bang theory as a fact but merely as a possibility.

    please define the long-age evolutionary paradigm.

    Quote Originally Posted by natiko View Post
    where do you even think the expression after-life comes from?
    I think the expression after-life comes from the fear of dying and nothing being there. If you die and nothing is there living has no point at all because you will forget everything eventually. To prevent this misery humans invented the term after-life.
    Last edited by Toxic Waltz; 05-03-2011 at 03:11 AM.

  4. #64
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    Quote Originally Posted by Maddoc View Post
    Irrelevent: Giners dont have souls <3

    Relevent: Don't you think that, after THOUSANDS of years, there would have been atleast ONE case of them reaching out to us? And don't consider "ghosts", as theyd be here on the mortal "plane", if they existed, not in heaven or hell.

    Also, while I absolutely HATE to say this, because I find it a stupid way to comeback, prove to me souls DO exist and go to heaven/hell. Because, if they DO exist, ok, cool, now how does having a soul have something to do with "god"?

    If "god" created this world, thats fine and dandy, but what if theres no heaven or hell? What if we just end up going to this, sortof airplane type thing, where you go through this time of unconciousness then end up being met by all your ancestors wavin at you like "HEY, HOW HAPPETH IT UP INETH THIS BITCH?!" and you just keep "living", but your dead.

    Kinda weird I know lol.
    Kinda stupid is what it is.

    I mean all you just said is like "hey what if i thought up some random scenario".


  5. #65
    Toxic Waltz's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Empire View Post


    Kinda stupid is what it is.

    I mean all you just said is like "hey what if i thought up some random scenario".
    He could sell it as a religion, it got all the requirements.

  6. #66
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    Quote Originally Posted by Toxic Waltz View Post
    He could sell it as a religion, it got all the requirements.
    All he needs is celebrity backing!


  7. #67
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    I rest my case <3

  8. #68
    Ethereal's Avatar
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    You know what I don't get about the bible's version of "God"

    So God is omnipotent, all knowing all powerful yet:

    He shows emotions of jealousy and anger.
    If he has knowledge of events that didn't take place yet, and also events that will happen in the future..
    then why would he seem surprised when man fails him?
    Why show anger or jealousy if you had prior knowledge of said events.

    Also, the Bible states that God cannot do evil..
    Yet he creates Satan, knowing that Satan will become pure evil.
    It's a different story if God had no knowledge that Satan would be evil, but this is God..so of course he did.
    How exactly isn't this considered an evil act?
    That's like Obama funding a terroist orginaztion fully knowing that they would kill many people,
    then saying: "Hey I didn't carry out the terror attacks"
    Last edited by Ethereal; 05-07-2011 at 12:04 PM.

  9. #69
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ethereal View Post
    You know what I don't get about the bible's version of "God"

    So God is omnipotent, all knowing all powerful yet:

    He shows emotions of jealousy and anger.
    If he has knowledge of events that didn't take place yet, and also events that will happen in the future..
    then why would he seem surprised when man fails him?
    Why show anger or jealousy if you had prior knowledge of said events.

    Also, the Bible states that God cannot do evil..
    Yet he creates Satan, knowing that Satan will become pure evil.
    It's a different story if God had no knowledge that Satan would be evil, but this is God..so of course he did.
    How exactly isn't this considered an evil act?
    That's like Obama funding a terroist orginaztion fully knowing that they would kill many people,
    then saying: "Hey I didn't carry out the terror attacks"

    I've always been curious about how people know that Satan is the bad-guy? God could very well be a capricious dictator who uses Satan as a scapegoat, this would make the Old Testament make much more sense, at least it has more explanatory power than saying a supreme deity changed his mind sometime two thousand years ago.
    "We swallow greedily any lie that flatters us, but we sip only little by little at a truth we find bitter." ~ Denis Diderot

  10. #70
    Ethereal's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Paroxysm View Post
    I've always been curious about how people know that Satan is the bad-guy? God could very well be a capricious dictator who uses Satan as a scapegoat, this would make the Old Testament make much more sense, at least it has more explanatory power than saying a supreme deity changed his mind sometime two thousand years ago.
    There is certainly more emphasis on Satan's evil attributes in the New Testament..
    Of course the Christian answer for this is that Satan's true nature is fully revealed by Christ.
    Satan in hebrew means "advesary" The issue here is that in the OT sometimes it's extremely difficult to distinguish if Satan is a reference to Lucifer the fallen Archangel, or if it's just the english meaning of adversary being referenced . In the NT it's pretty clear in the many refrences to Satan that it's actually the Devil, or Lucifer being explained.
    Last edited by Ethereal; 05-07-2011 at 12:41 PM.

  11. #71
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    i always believe in god
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    It is the best game

  12. #72
    Synchromanica's Avatar
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    Hmm, I think of it like this. God didn't create anything bad. It was Lucifer. Like humans, God created the angels with a free will. Because of this, Lucifer became obsessed with himself, and sinned against God. He didn't want to "Just" be an angel of God, he wanted to be equal, or possibly above God. Because of this, God cast him out of Heaven, and on to Earth. He and 1/3 of Heavens angels warred against God, and lost. This is where Lucifer began to be referred to as Devil, which means Chief of evil and enemy of God, which could also mean Satan(adversary of God)

    Revelation 12:4-13 (King James Version) "And his tail drew the third part of the stars of heaven, and did cast them to the earth: and the dragon stood before the woman which was ready to be delivered, for to devour her child as soon as it was born. And she brought forth a man child, who was to rule all nations with a rod of iron: and her child was caught up unto God, and to his throne. And the woman fled into the wilderness, where she hath a place prepared of God, that they should feed her there a thousand two hundred and threescore days. And there was war in heaven: Michael and his angels fought against the dragon; and the dragon fought and his angels, And prevailed not; neither was their place found any more in heaven. And the great dragon was cast out, that old serpent, called the Devil, and Satan, which deceiveth the whole world: he was cast out into the earth, and his angels were cast out with him." When the dragon saw that he had been hurled to the earth, he pursued the woman who had given birth to the male child.

    In here, they are talking about Lucifer, a dragon and the angels that were on his side, and their war against God. Hhe is cast out, and was given the name "Devil", and "Satan". The angels that were exiled with him became known as Demons. So it would be like Sin had entered Earth. Later on, Adam and Eve are tempted by a snake, and they give in, receiving sin. Because of this, death was created. If nobody had noticed, there are no deaths told in the War between God and Lucifer.

    Satans appearance to most most people would be a hoofed creature, red in color, with horns on his head. However, this is not what he actually looked like. In fact, this appearance is closer to that of Pan, who is a God from Greek mythology. Many people believe that the dragon was Lucifer because the dragon was described as having seven heads and ten horns, and seven crowns upon his heads. But Lucifer, was described as a being "of perfect beauty". He was covered in every precious stone. He had pendants and jewels of gold. Lucifer was beautiful before he sinned. An expression of Gods own beauty and power. But like man, Lucifer’s very nature changed when he sinned. His (Lucifer’s) physical appearance may have as well.

    The reason why God didn't just destroy Satan, was because he would have to kill Adam, whom he loved. So he had thought up another way, he would create himself in flesh, and redeem the world. So then Satan remained with the fallen angels, and still does, awaiting judgement, which would be on "Judgement Day". In the bible, it is also stated that Satan is the Father of all Lies.

    @Ethereal, this website explains it better than I do. If God is all knowing and he knows our future, then how is that free will? | Christian Apologetics and Research Ministry
    God did not do evil, Satan had free will, and decided to evil himself. Everybody has free will, and can do whatever they want with it. The fact that Satan did, means that Satan did, why blame God for something Satan did. Also, you're trying to describe God using human definitions. Not once in the bible is he described as omnipotent. Proof: Bible Verses That Describe Who God Is
    Omnipotent is what WE use to describe him, but he in not one who can be described with just one word.
    Quoted from wikipedia:
    Within the Biblical context, God is almighty (not omnipotent) because there is no other entity that can thwart Him in whatever he decides to do. Therefore, the proper questions relative to God's power, would be: (1) Can any other entity (or alleged deity) create a rock too heavy for God to lift and (2) Can God create a rock too heavy for any other entity (or deity) to lift? The answers are no and yes. Thus, no other entity (or deity) can exert any power over God and claim to be more powerful than God.
    Augustine, in his City of God, argued, instead, that God could not do anything that would make God non-omnipotent:
    For He is called omnipotent on account of His doing what He wills, not on account of His suffering what He wills not; for if that should befall Him, He would by no means be omnipotent. Wherefore, He cannot do some things for the very reason that He is omnipotent.[9]
    Thus Augustine argued that God could not do anything or create any situation that would in effect make God not God. This question is in itself and in many forms answered by its own context for which it was questioned. He created you, the rock that he can move but He will not. (Free will)

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  14. #73
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    Quote Originally Posted by Shinobi View Post




    In here, they are talking about Lucifer, a dragon and the angels that were on his side, and their war against God. Hhe is cast out, and was given the name "Devil", and "Satan". The angels that were exiled with him became known as Demons. So it would be like Sin had entered Earth. Later on, Adam and Eve are tempted by a snake, and they give in, receiving sin. Because of this, death was created. If nobody had noticed, there are no deaths told in the War between God and Lucifer.

    Satans appearance to most most people would be a hoofed creature, red in color, with horns on his head. However, this is not what he actually looked like. In fact, this appearance is closer to that of Pan, who is a God from Greek mythology. Many people believe that the dragon was Lucifer because the dragon was described as having seven heads and ten horns, and seven crowns upon his heads. But Lucifer, was described as a being "of perfect beauty". He was covered in every precious stone. He had pendants and jewels of gold. Lucifer was beautiful before he sinned. An expression of Gods own beauty and power. But like man, Lucifer’s very nature changed when he sinned. His (Lucifer’s) physical appearance may have as well.

    The reason why God didn't just destroy Satan, was because he would have to kill Adam, whom he loved. So he had thought up another way, he would create himself in flesh, and redeem the world. So then Satan remained with the fallen angels, and still does, awaiting judgement, which would be on "Judgement Day". In the bible, it is also stated that Satan is the Father of all Lies.

    @Ethereal, this website explains it better than I do. If God is all knowing and he knows our future, then how is that free will? | Christian Apologetics and Research Ministry
    God did not do evil, Satan had free will, and decided to evil himself. Everybody has free will, and can do whatever they want with it. The fact that Satan did, means that Satan did, why blame God for something Satan did. Also, you're trying to describe God using human definitions. Not once in the bible is he described as omnipotent. Proof: Bible Verses That Describe Who God Is
    Omnipotent is what WE use to describe him, but he in not one who can be described with just one word.
    Quoted from wikipedia:
    Within the Biblical context, God is almighty (not omnipotent) because there is no other entity that can thwart Him in whatever he decides to do. Therefore, the proper questions relative to God's power, would be: (1) Can any other entity (or alleged deity) create a rock too heavy for God to lift and (2) Can God create a rock too heavy for any other entity (or deity) to lift? The answers are no and yes. Thus, no other entity (or deity) can exert any power over God and claim to be more powerful than God.
    Augustine, in his City of God, argued, instead, that God could not do anything that would make God non-omnipotent:
    For He is called omnipotent on account of His doing what He wills, not on account of His suffering what He wills not; for if that should befall Him, He would by no means be omnipotent. Wherefore, He cannot do some things for the very reason that He is omnipotent.[9]
    Thus Augustine argued that God could not do anything or create any situation that would in effect make God not God. This question is in itself and in many forms answered by its own context for which it was questioned. He created you, the rock that he can move but He will not. (Free will)
    Yeah yeah yeah..way too long btw.

    But even still my argument still stands.
    I understand that Satan had free will, and so does man..
    But you can't sit here and tell me that God didn't make anything bad.
    He knew before hand that Satan would be evil..
    According to the Bible, it was because of Satan that the first sin took place, which in turn instilled man with a sin nature that was not within Adam and Eve before the Devil tempted them.
    God allegedly created a being that unleashed every possible act of immortality onto man.
    Think about it.. if you interpet the Bible correctly then this means that man would have just continued to love God and basically be forever harmonious with one another if Satan was never created.
    What logical explanation is out there to justify this? What was the point..? Only thing I could think of is boredom, and if that's the case then the "Benevolent" God of the Bible seems to be quite opposite of that.

  15. #74
    L3G3ND_KILL3R's Avatar
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    I believe in god~


    Need help with CALL OF DUTY RELATED or anything just private message me and im willing to help ^____^ Have a nice day!
    Quote Originally Posted by HelpIsWanted View Post
    so i have a camp next month, and i am 12, now all boys in my class have a large dick with hari and i dont have that. who can help me please?
    i see in films people can grow hair and grow dicks.

    i know its weird question, but i need !

  16. #75
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    People say the Bible says the world is going to end May 21st? The fuck up with that.

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