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  1. #16
    Ethereal's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Temperrr View Post

    That was translated word 2 word which made the meaning change ...
    Why should be lying about this ? .
    Dude, let me explain something to you.
    If this was a matter of transliteration, then Islam has been misleading many of it's English speaking followers.
    That just makes no sense whatsoever. If there is any transliteration it would be in the single word form and only slightly different.
    To have transliteration with whole passages would mean that whoever transcribed the Quran to English were all totally ignorant.
    Like I said that is hard to believe. We're talking about multiple Scholars educated in both languages that took that job on.
    It was their duty to make sure the Quran was spread throughout the world in many languages so everyone would have a chance to convert.
    So you're telling me that the English version is completely inaccurate and has full passages botched? C'mon man.. be real.

  2. #17
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    Quote Originally Posted by Symmetrical View Post
    What are the good things you like in Islam .. ?



    Please do not post anything against Islam ..
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  3. #18
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ethereal View Post
    Quran was spread throughout the world in many languages
    The language of the Quran is hard to translate and it wasn't meant to be translated to different languages ..

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  4. #19
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    Quote Originally Posted by Symmetrical View Post


    The language of the Quran is hard to translate and it wasn't meant to be translated to different languages ..
    It was written in Arabic, Koine Greek and Aramaic are considered to be much harder languages to transcribe but the Christians got it done..

    So how exactly do you spread the "real" word of Allah if it's only meant for one demographic? That makes no sense.

  5. #20
    Ameer's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ethereal View Post


    Dude, let me explain something to you.
    If this was a matter of transliteration, then Islam has been misleading many of it's English speaking followers.
    That just makes no sense whatsoever. If there is any transliteration it would be in the single word form and only slightly different.
    To have transliteration with whole passages would mean that whoever transcribed the Quran to English were all totally ignorant.
    Like I said that is hard to believe. We're talking about multiple Scholars educated in both languages that took that job on.
    It was their duty to make sure the Quran was spread throughout the world in many languages so everyone would have a chance to convert.
    So you're telling me that the English version is completely inaccurate and has full passages botched? C'mon man.. be real.
    I can't really explain my point here to you buddy , what I read in the Qura'an had a different meaning of what you have posted , same as Jihad concept. You guys think Qura'an says Jihad = Kill innoncent people in the name of Allah when it's not.
    The Language of Qura'an is hard for Arabs to understand so what about foreign people ? Dude take this example the word "Allah" can be pronounced more than 5 ways , it has 4 meanings depends where it's located in the sentence ... I hope you that you are understanding what i'm trying to say.
    I'm not defending Qur'an / Islam , I told tons of people before I'm just a Muslim in name , I don't believe in Allah or Islam or any other religion , but Im discussing what I'm learning at school and what I know.
    Last edited by Ameer; 06-06-2013 at 11:12 AM. Reason: Typo

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  7. #21
    Ethereal's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Temperrr View Post

    I can't really explain my point here to you buddy , what I read in the Qura'an had a different meaning of what you have posted , same as Jihad concept. You guys think Qura'an says Jihad = Kill innoncent people in the name of Allah when it's not.
    The Language of Qura'an is hard for Arabs to understand so what about foreign people ? Dude take this example the word "Allah" can be pronounced more than 5 ways , it has 4 meanings depends where it's located in the sentence ... I hope you that you are understanding what i'm trying to say.
    I'm not defending Qur'an / Islam , I told tons of people before I'm just a Muslim in name , I don't believe in Allah or Islam or any other religion , but Im discussing what I'm learning at school and what I know.
    Not all Westerners think Jihad means that. I know it means struggle but the Quran is vague to that context so it's pretty open to interpretation.
    That's why extremists have no problem doing what they do. I understand the language differences but if you think Arabic is hard,
    you should see Greek, They have many different words for certain things but generally they all mean the same thing in definition.
    If you say there are variants in modern day Qurans, then that actually proves false the claim that Muslims make. That the Quran is perfectly preserved.

  8. #22
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ethereal View Post
    Not all Westerners think Jihad means that. I know it means struggle but the Quran is vague to that context so it's pretty open to interpretation.
    That's why extremists have no problem doing what they do. I understand the language differences but if you think Arabic is hard,
    you should see Greek, They have many different words for certain things but generally they all mean the same thing in definition.
    If you say there are variants in modern day Qurans, then that actually proves false the claim that Muslims make. That the Quran is perfectly preserved.
    I'm not gonna try to debate which language is harder but Arabic is a fucking hard language , especially the formal...Which the Quraan somehow is called the most formal ...

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  9. #23
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ethereal View Post


    I lol'ed.. especially at the religion part.

    Qur’an (2:65-66) Christians and Jews must believe what Allah has revealed to Muhammad or Allah will disfigure their faces or turn them into apes, as he did the Sabbath-breakers. (I'm pretty sexy, don't look like a monkey btw..hmmm someone is full of shit eh?)

    Ishaq:364 “Muslims, take not Jews and Christians as friends. Whoever protects them becomes one of them, they become diseased, and will earn a similar fate.

    Qur’an 5:53 Jews and Christians are losers.

    Qur’an 5:59 Jews and Christians are evil-livers.

    Qur’an 4:91- If the unbelievers do not offer you peace, kill them wherever you find them. Against such you are given clear warrant.
    lol , it doesn't mean that .. u need to know Arabic language so u can understand the shit that written in qur'aan.

  10. #24
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ayyash View Post
    lol , it doesn't mean that .. u need to know Arabic language so u can understand the shit that written in qur'aan.
    Sigh. Here we go again. No I don't need to know Arabic, because Arabs transcribed the Quran to English.
    You telling me that it's not accurate is a joke, considering that scholars well versed in both Arabic and English know a little more than some kid on MPGH.

  11. #25
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ethereal View Post


    Sigh. Here we go again. No I don't need to know Arabic, because Arabs transcribed the Quran to English.
    You telling me that it's not accurate is a joke, considering that scholars well versed in both Arabic and English know a little more than some kid on MPGH.
    I don't care about this shitty religion , atheist4life

  12. #26
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ayyash View Post
    I don't care about this shitty religion , atheist4life
    So you reply to me with a false statement, then have nothing to say to my rebuttal besides the fact that you're an Atheist.

    Alrighty then.

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  14. #27
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    The "translation argument" is a silly one.

    Even in arabic it means the same thing, but trying to tell someone that it means something different is kind of silly.

    "Hey that translation is bad, trust me instead of mutiple scholars and an entire industry, because my translation is right"

    :/


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    Quote Originally Posted by Ethereal View Post
    So you reply to me with a false statement, then have nothing to say to my rebuttal besides the fact that you're an Atheist.
    Alrighty then.
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    Troll nomination. Allah and Muhammad for 1400 years of bullshit.

  16. #29
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    Quote Originally Posted by Empire View Post
    The "translation argument" is a silly one.

    Even in arabic it means the same thing, but trying to tell someone that it means something different is kind of silly.

    "Hey that translation is bad, trust me instead of mutiple scholars and an entire industry, because my translation is right"

    :/
    That argument is legit as could be. You have sayings and ways of building sentences in one language, whilst an other language is completely different, yet may mean the same, or is completely the same, yet may mean something different.

    Reading certain parts of the quran does not suffit to understand a certain verse's meaning. You have to read everything in the quran to get what it means. Thats why it is advised to read the whole quran a few times.

    Its really complicated since even old ancient wisemen who spoke the language perfectly could not even get the meaning.
    It seems as if the muslims are using this as a silly excuse for their actions, but if you would live in a muslim world(as in being a true muslim yourself) then you would understand what I am talking about.
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  17. #30
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    Quote Originally Posted by Frost View Post


    That argument is legit as could be. You have sayings and ways of building sentences in one language, whilst an other language is completely different, yet may mean the same, or is completely the same, yet may mean something different.

    Reading certain parts of the quran does not suffit to understand a certain verse's meaning. You have to read everything in the quran to get what it means. Thats why it is advised to read the whole quran a few times.

    Its really complicated since even old ancient wisemen who spoke the language perfectly could not even get the meaning.
    It seems as if the muslims are using this as a silly excuse for their actions, but if you would live in a muslim world(as in being a true muslim yourself) then you would understand what I am talking about.
    Its actually very, very simple.


    Does it translate? Yes or no.

    Yes it does: then i'll take the scholars over some stupid shit on the internet. You know, the actual true muslim scholars, the ones who dedicated their life to such a menial task as to translate a book.

    No it doesn't: Then why. Why does it not translate? Every language roughly translates to another one, and the more specific ones(english) have a ton of availability for translations. The entirety of other arabic works can translate, and many other languages as well. Now it might not be a perfect translation but there is always notes and such to make up the gap. However, in most (if not all) of the translations, it is the literal translation.
    ------------------------

    In the end it is actually very simple: you are making up bullshit.

    Its your opinion trying to influence the words already in clear text. That isn't a bad "translation" that is just you not agreeing with the reality of it.
    Last edited by Empire; 06-11-2013 at 06:51 PM.


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