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  1. #1
    Empire's Avatar
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    The concept of Sin.

    Ok so I'm going to make a thread eventually about sin and it's workings in the bible and christianity, so I thought i'd make a topic discussing the concept of it beforehand.

    Note
    : I'm not talking about what is qualified as a sin, but more what sin is itself.

    ---------------------------------------
    Now there seems to me to be two different concepts of sin to me.

    1. Morality. This is that anything immoral is a sin in the general sense. The ten commandments serve as an example.
    -Majority of people believe this.

    2. Disobedience. Anything against god, is a sin. Seen in the garden of eden and others, where sin is rather trivial but punishment is extreme.
    -----------

    Your thoughts?


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    666HiddenMaster666's Avatar
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    I see sins as radical versions of indulgences. Based upon the seven deadly sins. Could be expanded to include other human natures (nothing off the top of my head atm).
    Last edited by 666HiddenMaster666; 04-19-2014 at 01:36 AM.
    Quote Originally Posted by Extravagant View Post
    The problem is that we're people. People are shitty beings, you just gotta keep that in mind.
    "Science is interesting, and if you don't agree you can fuck off." - Richard Dawkins
    "Only two things are infinite, the universe and human stupidity, and I'm not sure about the former." - Albert Einstein

    Quote Originally Posted by Lehsyrus View Post
    Troll nomination. Allah and Muhammad for 1400 years of bullshit.

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    Empire's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by 666HiddenMaster666 View Post
    I see sins as radical versions of indulgences. Based upon the seven deadly sins. Could be expanded to include other human natures (nothing off the top of my head atm).
    Ok which seven deadly sins? Because there is one from the bible and one from the Divine Comedy.

    Most people only use the Divine comedy(gluttony/lust/wrath etc..).


    Also indulgences....they would be how they are forgiven?
    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Indulgence
    Last edited by Empire; 04-19-2014 at 02:07 AM.


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    Ferris Bueller's Avatar
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    These 2 concepts are present in all abrahimic religions and several other religions.

    Their purpose? Control, restrain, maintain the system.


    In fact some of these sins even go against human nature(masturbating, eating certain foods, several others that i'm forgetting about). They are meant to keep the citizens in line and make them fit a certain "perfect" standard(in the eyes of the religious leaders).

    Then again, most of these sins are reasonable. Killing, stealing, being disrespectful. On the other hand some of them aren't necessary but shouldn't affect your life in a major way such as eating pork or drinking alcohol(i think not drinking alcohol is the way to go anyways).

    "“Religions are, by definition, metaphors, after all: God is a dream, a hope, a woman, an ironist, a father, a city, a house of many rooms, a watchmaker who left his prize chronometer in the desert, someone who loves you—even, perhaps, against all evidence, a celestial being whose only interest is to make sure your football team, army, business, or marriage thrives, prospers, and triumphs over all opposition. Religions are places to stand and look and act, vantage points from which to view the world. So none of this is happening. Such things could not occur. Never a word of it is literally true.” .”
    I was Martin Johnson

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    666HiddenMaster666's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Empire View Post
    Ok which seven deadly sins? Because there is one from the bible and one from the Divine Comedy.
    Most people only use the Divine comedy(gluttony/lust/wrath etc..).
    Also indulgences....they would be how they are forgiven?
    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Indulgence
    I don't think there's a difference between the two
    Seven Deadly Sins Cultural References

    And no, I don't mean that kind indulgences nor as a way of forgiving
    I meant that the sins are radical version of simple indulgences that humans naturally crave
    For example, gluttony is the radical version of the indulgence of eating and tasting food
    Another one would be lust being the radical version of the indulgence of sex for pleasure
    Last edited by 666HiddenMaster666; 04-19-2014 at 10:03 AM.
    Quote Originally Posted by Extravagant View Post
    The problem is that we're people. People are shitty beings, you just gotta keep that in mind.
    "Science is interesting, and if you don't agree you can fuck off." - Richard Dawkins
    "Only two things are infinite, the universe and human stupidity, and I'm not sure about the former." - Albert Einstein

    Quote Originally Posted by Lehsyrus View Post
    Troll nomination. Allah and Muhammad for 1400 years of bullshit.

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    Empire's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by 666HiddenMaster666 View Post


    I don't think there's a difference between the two
    Seven Deadly Sins Cultural References

    And no, I don't mean that kind indulgences nor as a way of forgiving
    I meant that the sins are radical version of simple indulgences that humans naturally crave
    For example, gluttony is the radical version of the indulgence of eating and tasting food
    Another one would be lust being the radical version of the indulgence of sex for pleasure
    Well the difference is one is based off the bible and one is from the bible.


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    666HiddenMaster666's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Empire View Post
    Well the difference is one is based off the bible and one is from the bible.
    Aren't they still the same thing? If not, what are the differences?
    Quote Originally Posted by Extravagant View Post
    The problem is that we're people. People are shitty beings, you just gotta keep that in mind.
    "Science is interesting, and if you don't agree you can fuck off." - Richard Dawkins
    "Only two things are infinite, the universe and human stupidity, and I'm not sure about the former." - Albert Einstein

    Quote Originally Posted by Lehsyrus View Post
    Troll nomination. Allah and Muhammad for 1400 years of bullshit.

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    Empire's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by 666HiddenMaster666 View Post


    Aren't they still the same thing? If not, what are the differences?
    Proverbs 6:16-19
    New International Version (NIV)
    16 There are six things the Lord hates,
    seven that are detestable to him:
    17 haughty eyes,
    a lying tongue,
    hands that shed innocent blood,
    18 a heart that devises wicked schemes,
    feet that are quick to rush into evil,
    19 a false witness who pours out lies
    and a person who stirs up conflict in the community.

    Those are the ones stated in the bible which the seven deadly sins are based off of.

    But it was a creation of the church. Not according to the bible.


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    Empire's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ferris Bueller View Post


    Their purpose? Control, restrain, maintain the system.
    I'm not asking what their purpose was.


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    Ferris Bueller's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Empire View Post


    I'm not asking what their purpose was.
    Then I'm misunderstanding your question.

    I gave you an answer on my thoughts.

    What are you looking for?

    "“Religions are, by definition, metaphors, after all: God is a dream, a hope, a woman, an ironist, a father, a city, a house of many rooms, a watchmaker who left his prize chronometer in the desert, someone who loves you—even, perhaps, against all evidence, a celestial being whose only interest is to make sure your football team, army, business, or marriage thrives, prospers, and triumphs over all opposition. Religions are places to stand and look and act, vantage points from which to view the world. So none of this is happening. Such things could not occur. Never a word of it is literally true.” .”
    I was Martin Johnson

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    Rance-Sama's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ferris Bueller View Post
    What are you looking for?
    Well, ya know, the thread title. He even noted it (in bold) for you.

  12. #12
    Ferris Bueller's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Rance-sama View Post
    Well, ya know, the thread title. He even noted it (in bold) for you.
    Ok I feel dumb now.

    Well you know sins are whatever your deity doesn't want you to do.

    Like I said some of them don't make sense but you just have to follow them.

    Usually they're whatever is wrong at that time period. Which is why slavery isn't a sin in abrahimic religions.

    "“Religions are, by definition, metaphors, after all: God is a dream, a hope, a woman, an ironist, a father, a city, a house of many rooms, a watchmaker who left his prize chronometer in the desert, someone who loves you—even, perhaps, against all evidence, a celestial being whose only interest is to make sure your football team, army, business, or marriage thrives, prospers, and triumphs over all opposition. Religions are places to stand and look and act, vantage points from which to view the world. So none of this is happening. Such things could not occur. Never a word of it is literally true.” .”
    I was Martin Johnson

  13. #13
    666HiddenMaster666's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Empire View Post
    Proverbs 6:16-19
    New International Version (NIV)
    16 There are six things the Lord hates,
    seven that are detestable to him:
    17 haughty eyes,
    a lying tongue,
    hands that shed innocent blood,
    18 a heart that devises wicked schemes,
    feet that are quick to rush into evil,
    19 a false witness who pours out lies
    and a person who stirs up conflict in the community.
    Those are the ones stated in the bible which the seven deadly sins are based off of.
    But it was a creation of the church. Not according to the bible.
    I suppose you can take a combination of the two together, but I think I'm referring to the Devine Comedy one
    Quote Originally Posted by Extravagant View Post
    The problem is that we're people. People are shitty beings, you just gotta keep that in mind.
    "Science is interesting, and if you don't agree you can fuck off." - Richard Dawkins
    "Only two things are infinite, the universe and human stupidity, and I'm not sure about the former." - Albert Einstein

    Quote Originally Posted by Lehsyrus View Post
    Troll nomination. Allah and Muhammad for 1400 years of bullshit.

  14. #14
    Empire's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ferris Bueller View Post


    Then I'm misunderstanding your question.

    I gave you an answer on my thoughts.

    What are you looking for?

    I was looking for what people thought they were based upon the bible.(or the quran if you knew).

    Because I'm going to do a thread later next week about sins and there relationship to the workings of the bible and its system.
    ----------------

    In other words, I was wondering if people had an idea based on the text, not based upon what their personal opinion is of sin.

    Quote Originally Posted by 666HiddenMaster666 View Post


    I suppose you can take a combination of the two together, but I think I'm referring to the Devine Comedy one
    Most likely, the seven sins most people know are from early catholic teachings and dante's divine comedy.

    But I was wondering if you had a biblical reasoning for what sin is.

    Last edited by Empire; 04-20-2014 at 12:59 AM.


  15. #15
    666HiddenMaster666's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Empire View Post
    Most likely, the seven sins most people know are from early catholic teachings and dante's divine comedy. But I was wondering if you had a biblical reasoning for what sin is.
    Based on the Proverbs you C+Ped earlier, I'd say the reasoning for any sins is that it destroys the most important part of survival, staying together. The seven that was mentioned before all negatively affect the community, no matter how big or small the deed or community is.
    Quote Originally Posted by Extravagant View Post
    The problem is that we're people. People are shitty beings, you just gotta keep that in mind.
    "Science is interesting, and if you don't agree you can fuck off." - Richard Dawkins
    "Only two things are infinite, the universe and human stupidity, and I'm not sure about the former." - Albert Einstein

    Quote Originally Posted by Lehsyrus View Post
    Troll nomination. Allah and Muhammad for 1400 years of bullshit.

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