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  1. #16
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    Quote Originally Posted by Empire View Post
    Well here's an easy way to solve this:

    Prove it.

    My thoughts: Of course there isn't a correlation between Islam and education, most of Islam's population is in third world countries with horrible education systems.

    The people who generally convert to Islam are doing it for :
    A) Attention
    B) Stupidity, they'll convert to anything that someone tells them is "true"
    C)Re-conversion, people who were already muslims convert back.
    No, No and No.

    I will prove that there is correlation between Islam (specially) and education. Islam existed about 1500 years ago, I won't talk about the correlation in our time as you won't be convinced. Again and again I will give you a quote to explain why I won't talk about the correlation in our time.

    The term Third World arose during the Cold War to define countries that remained non-aligned with either NATO (with the United States, Western European nations and their allies representing the First World), or the Communist Bloc (with the Soviet Union, China, Cuba, and their allies representing the Second World).
    Quoting some things from sources:
    The Islamic Golden Age started with the rise of Islam and establishment of the first Islamic state in 622. The end of the age is variously given as 1258 with the Mongolian Sack of Baghdad,[1] or 1492 with the completion of the Christian Reconquista of the Emirate of Granada in Al-Andalus, Iberian Peninsula. During the reign of the Abbasid caliph Harun ar-Rashid (786 to 809),[2] the House of Wisdom was inaugurated in Baghdad where scholars from various parts of the world sought to translate and gather all the known world's knowledge into Arabic.[3] The Abbasids were influenced by the Quranic injunctions and hadiths, such as "the ink of a scholar is more holy than the blood of a martyr," that stressed the value of knowledge.[3] During the age, the major Islamic capital cities of Baghdad, Cairo, and Córdoba became the main intellectual centers for science, philosophy, medicine, and education.
    Islam's population became the worst educated after the Mongolian attacks in middle east destroying the science books which were invented by Muslims and killing scientists, etc..

    Muslims ruled the Science, Mathematics, Physics, Biology, Medicine, Commerce and travel and Culture.

    By the way, the numbers which you are using were created by Muslims. (one two three four etc..)

    Read : Islamic Golden Age - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
    Science in the medieval Islamic world - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
    Science Islam - Muslims Contribution To Science
    [Regents Prep Global History] Golden Ages: Golden Age of Islam

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cG1xlCZUUH8

    That's a proof.

    PS: Read this : http://wikiislam.net/wiki/Jacques_Cousteau_%28Conversion_to_Islam%29
    Last edited by Frought; 07-25-2014 at 06:30 PM.

  2. #17
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    You are using the "Islamic golden age"(which isn't a thing btw, Islam had nothing to do with any of the science) to now.

    I believe I've already had this conversation so I'll just summarize it for the sake of time.

    -I post that just because you are a Muslim does not mean Islam created or did anything with science. Those are all personal achievements.
    -Then after you don't understand this I need to point that a religion does not get credit for everything any of it's followers do
    -Then after you insist that it does I point to terrorist and of course you throw a hissy fit here.
    -Eventually what this all boils down to is you not understanding that there is a lot higher percentage of atheist/agnostic in the higher education population.



    Feel free to respond, but I've already been over this a dozen times.


  3. #18
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    Quote Originally Posted by Empire View Post
    -I post that just because you are a Muslim does not mean Islam created or did anything with science. Those are all personal achievements.
    Then why you don't say that Atheism didn't do anything or create anything with science ?
    I wont respond to other points as what I said responds to all other points.

    I will make a thread with the subject Qur'an miracles also, I like your discussion so it might be useful for us to discuss in everything.
    If the facts don't fit the theory, change the facts.
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  4. #19
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    Quote Originally Posted by Frought View Post

    Then why you don't say that Atheism didn't do anything or create anything with science ?
    I wont respond to other points as what I said responds to all other points.

    I will make a thread with the subject Qur'an miracles also, I like your discussion so it might be useful for us to discuss in everything.
    I'm not saying Atheism takes credit for their works. I'm saying the higher educated populace is generally atheist and its generally noted that the more education you get and the more you learn about science the less hold religion has on the person.


    Muslims have a really bad habit of using the very few achievements that muslims have to say that islam is better than anything.


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  6. #20
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    Quote Originally Posted by Empire View Post
    Muslims have a really bad habit of using the very few achievements that muslims have to say that islam is better than anything.
    I didn't use it, I was talking about all religions but you just converted it to Islam that's why I said that.

    By the way I think putting the Qur'an miracles here is in the right place since it is about science.
    If the facts don't fit the theory, change the facts.
    Learn from yesterday, live for today, hope for tomorrow. The important thing is not to stop questioning.
    Try not to become a man of success, but rather try to become a man of value.
    You have to learn the rules of the game. And then you have to play better than anyone else.

    -Albert Einstein



  7. #21
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    Quote Originally Posted by Frought View Post

    I didn't use it, I was talking about all religions but you just converted it to Islam that's why I said that.

    By the way I think putting the Qur'an miracles here is in the right place since it is about science.
    You just used the "islamic golden age"(which isn't a thing).

    I would not recommend posting "miracles" of the quran. As you'd have to provide proof, not just say-so.


  8. #22
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    Quote Originally Posted by Empire View Post
    You just used the "islamic golden age"(which isn't a thing).

    I would not recommend posting "miracles" of the quran. As you'd have to provide proof, not just say-so.
    empire i think your completely right

    i think someone being religious is a sign to a lack of education. there is no doubt a religious man wont accept that babies come from an egg and semen because the bible or whatever says:babies are a present from "god"

    religion is the exact opposite to science. and thats why saying atheists tend to be more educated is true.

    in history it shows how back in the day the church tried to stop the scientists from learning and spreading their research because it will hurt them.

    Frought is giving some biased opinions based on religion itself so there isnt much to argue with.

    he is part of the educational gap,and i think you explained the topic pretty well...i never thougth about religion in that way.

  9. #23
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    Quote Originally Posted by Empire View Post
    I would not recommend posting "miracles" of the quran. As you'd have to provide proof, not just say-so.
    I will.

    Quote Originally Posted by Empire View Post
    You just used the "islamic golden age"(which isn't a thing).
    As I said, you converted it to Islam. I was talking about all religions.

    Quote Originally Posted by Ex0rPl4net View Post
    religion is the exact opposite to science. and thats why saying atheists tend to be more educated is true.
    Give a proof.

    Quote Originally Posted by Ex0rPl4net View Post
    Frought is giving some biased opinions based on religion itself so there isnt much to argue with.
    No. I didn't say "opinion", I said actual proofs.


    Quote Originally Posted by Empire View Post
    I post that just because you are a Muslim does not mean Islam created or did anything with science. Those are all personal achievements.
    Duh. When a Muslim kills some people you say its Islam.

    Quote Originally Posted by Ex0rPl4net View Post
    he is part of the educational gap,and i think you explained the topic pretty well...i never thougth about religion in that way.
    No. I'm not from it, prove it. I won't say "Oh, you are a religious man therefore you are from the educational gap.". That's stupid though.
    If the facts don't fit the theory, change the facts.
    Learn from yesterday, live for today, hope for tomorrow. The important thing is not to stop questioning.
    Try not to become a man of success, but rather try to become a man of value.
    You have to learn the rules of the game. And then you have to play better than anyone else.

    -Albert Einstein



  10. #24
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    Quote Originally Posted by Frought View Post
    I will.
    As I said, you converted it to Islam. I was talking about all religions.
    Give a proof.
    No. I didn't say "opinion", I said actual proofs.
    Duh. When a Muslim kills some people you say its Islam.
    No. I'm not from it, prove it. I won't say "Oh, you are a religious man therefore you are from the educational gap.". That's stupid though.
    I'm waiting on that proof.
    Actually you specifically said Islam.
    Quote Originally Posted by Frought View Post

    Sorry but your argument is wrong. Europe had 44 million Muslims in 2010. In USA, there is more than 20.0000 converts to Islam every year.
    Also, according to the New York Times, an estimated 25 percent of American Muslims are converts.
    Did you think I wouldn't quote you on that?

    Science uses evidence and draws conclusions. Religion takes the conclusion(god did it) and applies it to anything science has not yet explained.

    Unfortunately those aren't proof.
    ---------

    The gap in education is pretty much the reason religion is still around. People use "god did it" to explain everything they are ignorant of.


  11. #25
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    Quote Originally Posted by Frought View Post
    Give a proof.
    http://burro.astr.cwru.edu/stu/pre20...pe_church.html
    i think threatening to kill anyone saying something diffrent then the church thinks is a pretty good proof

  12. #26
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    Quote Originally Posted by Empire View Post


    So your argument is that anything is good as long as there is a big enough population following it?

    Surely you understand how stupid that is.....right? I don't need to point this out again.......right?
    ... /10 char
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  13. #27
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    Quote Originally Posted by Empire View Post


    I'm waiting on that proof.
    What are you talking about?

    Quote Originally Posted by Empire View Post
    Actually you specifically said Islam.
    Read post #5 again I said Islam because I don't know about any other religions. But I was talking about religions generally since there is high educated people joins / believes in a religion.


    Quote Originally Posted by Empire View Post
    Science uses evidence and draws conclusions. Religion takes the conclusion(god did it) and applies it to anything science has not yet explained.

    Unfortunately those aren't proof.
    ---------

    The gap in education is pretty much the reason religion is still around. People use "god did it" to explain everything they are ignorant of.
    When you want a proof I will talk on Islam only .
    In the Qur'an there is almost an explanation for everything was created.

    Verse 54:1-2 in Qur'an

    The Hour (of Judgment) is nigh, and the moon is cleft asunder. But if they see a Sign, they turn away, and say, "This is (but) transient magic."(Qur'an, 54:1-2)
    Understand? This is 1500 years ago. No one knew that there is a split in the moon.

    NASA provides a picture of the moon, Guess what? The moon is split.
    http://apod.nasa.gov/apod/ap021029.html

    "They ask you to hasten the punishment. God will not break His promise. A day with your Lord is equivalent to a thousand years in the way you count" (Qur'an, 22:47)
    "He directs the whole affair from heaven to earth. Then it will again ascend to Him on a Day whose length is a thousand years by the way you measure" (Qur'an, 32:5)
    The Qur'an demonstrates perfect knowledge of the relativity of time long before Einstein’s theories were created.

    It is He Who has let free the two bodies of flowing water: One palatable and sweet, and the other salt and bitter; yet has He made a barrier between them, a partition that is forbidden to be passed. (Qur'an 25:53)
    This property of the seas, that is, that they meet and yet do not intermix, has only very recently been discovered by oceanographers. Because of the physical force called "surface tension," the waters of neighbouring seas do not mix. Caused by the difference in the density of their waters, surface tension prevents them from mingling with one another, just as if a thin wall were between them.

    Need more? Disprove this first.
    Last edited by Frought; 07-27-2014 at 08:23 AM.
    If the facts don't fit the theory, change the facts.
    Learn from yesterday, live for today, hope for tomorrow. The important thing is not to stop questioning.
    Try not to become a man of success, but rather try to become a man of value.
    You have to learn the rules of the game. And then you have to play better than anyone else.

    -Albert Einstein



  14. #28
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    Quote Originally Posted by Frought View Post

    What are you talking about?


    Read post #5 again I said Islam because I don't know about any other religions. But I was talking about religions generally since there is high educated people joins / believes in a religion.



    When you want a proof I will talk on Islam only .
    In the Qur'an there is almost an explanation for everything was created.

    Verse 54:1-2 in Qur'an



    Understand? This is 1500 years ago. No one knew that there is a split in the moon.

    NASA provides a picture of the moon, Guess what? The moon is split.
    http://apod.nasa.gov/apod/ap021029.html



    The Qur'an demonstrates perfect knowledge of the relativity of time long before Einstein’s theories were created.


    This property of the seas, that is, that they meet and yet do not intermix, has only very recently been discovered by oceanographers. Because of the physical force called "surface tension," the waters of neighbouring seas do not mix. Caused by the difference in the density of their waters, surface tension prevents them from mingling with one another, just as if a thin wall were between them.

    Need more? Disprove this first.
    I asked for proof, you said you would, and you have yet to provide any.
    -It's also not my fault you can't speak in general terms. If you talk about a specific subject only and only reference that subject, then I cannot just assume you mean all religions in general. (This is a defensive mechanism of claiming ignorance btw).
    ===========================
    On your so called "miracles"

    1. The moon is not split in two. This is called a fault line.
    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fault_(geology)
    -Your lack of education astounds me.

    2. Do you even know what the theory of relativity is?
    -Btw: the bible did the same thing before the quran, but it's still irrelevant.


    3. You mean the knowledge of two different types of water? Which has been known since well, forever?
    -Claiming two types of water does not prove knowledge of surface tension.
    -That would be the same as claiming that there is air and water and then claiming the Quran knew all about hydrogen bonding and the atom composition of both.
    -Even if you were to give the Quran this, it explains nothing of surface tension. All it amounts to is "god did it".



    You are claiming scientific discoveries as from the quran when it is not only obvious that the Quran had no part in it, but that the Quran didn't even explain anything to any degree. This backwards thinking is so idiotic that I can only be impressed. I mean you have to be really ignorant of how scientific discoveries work to even attempt this shit.


    So I just disproved all of those. Next?


  15. #29
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    87% of the wars are thanks to religion
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    Quote Originally Posted by Boombox View Post
    Shut the fuck up insane you pussy bitch.
    Quote Originally Posted by arunforce View Post
    Shut the fuck up kid, everything that comes out of your mouth sounds retarded as fuck.

  16. #30
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    Quote Originally Posted by Insane View Post


    source
    Oh he doesn't have one, I can assure you.


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