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  1. #76
    robinvanpersie's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by imblack View Post
    i mean, i'm not religious, but you are totally ignoring some key points. whether or not somebody believes in a religion is irrelevant. the only thing that's relevant is if that person is causing conflict and religion is the source. you also have to note that it's not all their fault about their beliefs. many muslims have been raised amongst a culture much different to ours. they have very poor education there. if you have been raised your entire life around these ideas, and have had no counter-arguments presented to you, it's hard to just drop everything you have ever known instantly. what you are doing is cherry picking. islam IS a very malevolent religion. so is christianity. but, religions are also EXTREMELY contradictory. there are savage and brutal parts of religion, but putting all of it under that one category is just as stupid as religion itself, as there are many peaceful muslims/christians and peaceful parts of islam/christianity also. if you look at your signature, you can see you have cherry picked the worst possible quotes you could find. i know the vast majority of the peaceful community is irrelevant. it took 11 muslims to kill 3000 people on 9/11. but to put them ALL under that category is just stupid.

    i'm just saying there is not problem with believing in a religion as long as you don't cause others grief with it. buddhism is a prime example of a religion like this. you can't blame people for how they have been brought up. if you had been brought up in these cultures, you would be exactly like them.
    The problem is that they don't even understand the verses they are cherry picking. Not every verse in the Quran that mentions non believers is talking about every single non-Muslim throughout time. When the Quran says to kill the unbelievers, it is only talking about the unbelievers at the time who were killing and oppressing people for simply being Muslim. That is why context is important.
    Science is learning about the creation, Islam is learning about the creator.

    Alif, Lam, Meem. - 2:1 Quran
    This is the Book about which there is no doubt, a guidance for those conscious of Allah(God) - 2:2 Quran
    Who believe in the unseen, establish prayer, and spend out of what We have provided for them, - 2:3 Quran
    And who believe in what has been revealed to you, [O Muhammad], and what was revealed before you, and of the Hereafter they are certain [in faith]. - 2:4 Quran
    Those are upon [right] guidance from their Lord, and it is those who are the successful. - 2:5 Quran
    Indeed, those who disbelieve - it is all the same for them whether you warn them or do not warn them - they will not believe. - 2:6 Quran

  2. #77
    Hunter Jr.'s Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by imblack View Post
    if you look at your signature, you can see you have cherry picked the worst possible quotes you could find.
    It's called a joke. Don't take it like a dick.


    Quote Originally Posted by imblack View Post
    what you are doing is cherry picking.
    Cherry picking the "select" few of the "extremists".

    @Jew for showing us this earlier, looks like someone can't use his scroll wheel, @imblack.


    Quote Originally Posted by imblack View Post
    it took 11 muslims to kill 3000 people on 9/11. but to put them ALL under that category is just stupid.
    http://cnsnews.com/news/article/capt...-ponder-impact

    Do you even google the shit you say? If I were you, I'd start googling your claims to make sure two clicks and a few words typed can't debunk what you say.

    When 9/11 happened, alot of Muslims hailed the Taliban and Al Qaeda as heroes. Those terrorists came from 4-5 different countries alone. You'd imagine what the majority would think. "Oh no, America that does not fit our standards religiously or culturally and the people we hate for being disgusting and not following the law of Islam got bombed! I feel so sorry!"

    I'd take a wild guess and say that you didn't know the laws of Islam come before any and all legislative laws in Egypt. If it does not abide by Islamic laws, then the law immediately is refused. That's 82+ million people in a single country following Islamic law.

    Sure there are "peaceful" christians. That's because they shove "forgiveness" and "being thankful" down your throat so hard and so far that you begin to regurgitate it. As @Empire said, they are freely willing to change their ideas and texts to fit modern morals and continue to be socially acceptable. Islam does not. Do not try to use a different religion as a grounds for your argument.
    Last edited by Hunter Jr.; 09-02-2015 at 04:33 PM.

  3. #78
    Johnnyk121's Avatar
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    A whole thread started with the purpose of discrediting a religion, then expecting someone on this forum to be able to change your mindset.
    At least have an open mind. The aim should be to attempt to understand one another not try and ridicule someone else.
    "Humanity is but a single brotherhood; so make peace with your brethren" Quran 49:10
    Everything in the Quran like the rest of the world is contextual, we can choose any kind of quote from a book over 1000 pages but it should be about wanting to know then wanting to hate.
    Any questions let me know

  4. #79
    Hunter Jr.'s Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Johnnyk121 View Post
    "Humanity is but a single brotherhood; so make peace with your brethren"
    "The believers are but brothers, so make settlement between your brothers. And fear Allah that you may receive mercy.

    http://quran.com/49/10

    >Says humanity
    >actually is "the believers"
    >forgets to include "fear allah"
    >expects his argument to be valid

  5. #80
    imblack's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Xarnix View Post
    It's called a joke. Don't take it like a dick.



    Cherry picking the "select" few of the "extremists".

    @Jew for showing us this earlier, looks like someone can't use his scroll wheel, @imblack.



    http://cnsnews.com/news/article/capt...-ponder-impact

    Do you even google the shit you say? If I were you, I'd start googling your claims to make sure two clicks and a few words typed can't debunk what you say.

    When 9/11 happened, alot of Muslims hailed the Taliban and Al Qaeda as heroes. Those terrorists came from 4-5 different countries alone. You'd imagine what the majority would think. "Oh no, America that does not fit our standards religiously or culturally and the people we hate for being disgusting and not following the law of Islam got bombed! I feel so sorry!"

    I'd take a wild guess and say that you didn't know the laws of Islam come before any and all legislative laws in Egypt. If it does not abide by Islamic laws, then the law immediately is refused. That's 82+ million people in a single country following Islamic law.

    Sure there are "peaceful" christians. That's because they shove "forgiveness" and "being thankful" down your throat so hard and so far that you begin to regurgitate it. As @Empire said, they are freely willing to change their ideas and texts to fit modern morals and continue to be socially acceptable. Islam does not. Do not try to use a different religion as a grounds for your argument.
    what you don't understand is that americans weren't just the only victims on 9/11. for a period of time after 9/11, muslims inside america were treated like dogs. i had a friend who lived in NYC after the bombings, and everybody hated muslims. they would get refused service at most places, spat on when walking around, and bullied so hard in schools that many muslims left school (my friends teacher even told him that muslims are disgusting and do not deserve this quality of education). after 9/11, living in america as a muslim was very hard. also, ISIS kills many muslims as is. you think police brutality is bad now? it was much worse for muslims back then, just back then nobody cared enough to riot about it.

    all religions have their exploits, and ISIS is just exploiting islam. the quran is contextual. it didn't intend to make islam a bloodthirsty killer, that's what people did. as i said, growing up in a privileged country, you would have no idea what it is like to grow up in these cultures. you seem VERY bias on this subject, maybe just consider that religion isn't the direct source of all evil. you see, religion is the main excuse for all these wars, but that can be said for anything.

    i used to have the same opinions on religion as you do, but then i actually decided to consider what people were telling me.

    and word for word quoting one of the most brutal quotes from the quran out of context is what you consider a joke?
    Last edited by imblack; 09-05-2015 at 07:58 PM.

  6. #81
    Hunter Jr.'s Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by imblack View Post
    what you don't understand is that americans weren't just the only victims on 9/11. for a period of time after 9/11, muslims inside america were treated like dogs. i had a friend who lived in NYC after the bombings, and everybody hated muslims. they would get refused service at most places, spat on when walking around, and bullied so hard in schools that many muslims left school (my friends teacher even told him that muslims are disgusting and do not deserve this quality of education). after 9/11, living in america as a muslim was very hard.
    Appealing to emotion. Kay.


    Quote Originally Posted by imblack View Post
    and ISIS is just exploiting islam.
    That's common knowledge. However, the people joining it are not exploiting it, they're the ones fooled by it and believe what they say.

    Quote Originally Posted by imblack View Post
    the quran is contextual. it didn't intend to make islam a bloodthirsty killer, that's what people did.
    [Remember] when your Lord inspired to the angels, "I am with you, so strengthen those who have believed. I will cast terror into the hearts of those who disbelieved, so strike [them] upon the necks and strike from them every fingertip." Quran 8:12.

    You're telling me that it's not the text that supports violence?

    By the way, it's not the most brutal. Also this quote is right on par. It's exactly straight from the Quran. Don't make shit up bby.
    Quote Originally Posted by imblack View Post
    then i actually decided to consider what people were telling me.
    Ah yes this classic argument. I've heard this so many times, and it's bullshit. We're reading and understanding it loud and fuckin clear, that's why we have a valid response in all of our posts.


    http://quran.com/2/191
    http://quran.com/2/193
    Here's yet another.

    In case you want to call bullshit, read this. And I mean read it. Don't just spend 5 minutes looking through it. Read it.
    http://www.thereligionofpeace.com/qu...3-violence.htm

    Shall I go on?
    Last edited by Hunter Jr.; 09-05-2015 at 07:43 PM.

  7. #82
    Reft's Avatar
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    I disagree, ISIS is not following the Quran. They are using Islam as an excuse for all their actions. You need to put yourself into the migrants' shoes. If you resided in Syria, would you move over to Europe if you had a chance, when your entire country is in a civil war? If you say no, you must either be in a good position, or part of the war itself.

    Where are you bringing this "then after some time they feel comfortable in these countries and start to enforce the VERY THING that made them leave the country they came from" from? This statement is not true.

  8. #83
    Empire's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Reft View Post
    I disagree, ISIS is not following the Quran. They are using Islam as an excuse for all their actions.
    Uhm. How is that not exactly what Muhammad did?

    Didn't he justify war through religion? Didn't he justify him taking a child bride through a "dream" he had?

    I mean at what point are we going to condemn ISIS for doing the exact things Allah told Muhammad to do?


    Who are we to say that they aren't hearing from God himself and that this is the next chapter for Islam?



    Just want you guys to think about how this shit actually looks to an atheist. You fucks condemn the same thing you praise your prophet for.


  9. #84
    robinvanpersie's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Empire View Post

    Who are we to say that they aren't hearing from God himself and that this is the next chapter for Islam?

    Just want you guys to think about how this shit actually looks to an atheist. You fucks condemn the same thing you praise your prophet for.
    This is on a another level of crazy. Not even Daesh themselves are saying "they're getting prophecies from God."

    If you could only see how funny your posts are from a Muslims perspective. I suggest watching less anime and playing video games, and opening up some books on Islam and the life of the Prophet pbuh.

    - - - Updated - - -

    Quote Originally Posted by Xarnix View Post
    Appealing to emotion. Kay.



    That's common knowledge. However, the people joining it are not exploiting it, they're the ones fooled by it and believe what they say.


    [Remember] when your Lord inspired to the angels, "I am with you, so strengthen those who have believed. I will cast terror into the hearts of those who disbelieved, so strike [them] upon the necks and strike from them every fingertip." Quran 8:12.

    You're telling me that it's not the text that supports violence?

    By the way, it's not the most brutal. Also this quote is right on par. It's exactly straight from the Quran. Don't make shit up bby.

    Ah yes this classic argument. I've heard this so many times, and it's bullshit. We're reading and understanding it loud and fuckin clear, that's why we have a valid response in all of our posts.


    http://quran.com/2/191
    http://quran.com/2/193
    Here's yet another.

    In case you want to call bullshit, read this. And I mean read it. Don't just spend 5 minutes looking through it. Read it.
    http://www.thereligionofpeace.com/qu...3-violence.htm

    Shall I go on?
    Not every single verse that mentions the unbelievers is talking about all non-Muslims for any time period. It is only talking about the non-Muslims at that time, who were killing and oppressing people for simply being Muslim.

    That is why you don't take verses out of context and you read the Tafsirs which explains the verse. That website is biased and does not want you to understand Islam, it wants you to be ignorant. It is so obvious.

  10. #85
    Johnnyk121's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Xarnix View Post
    "The believers are but brothers, so make settlement between your brothers. And fear Allah that you may receive mercy.

    http://quran.com/49/10

    >Says humanity
    >actually is "the believers"
    >forgets to include "fear allah"
    >expects his argument to be valid
    You seem to have misunderstood the point of the reply. Again your attempting to disprove and cause problems rather then wanting to understand. I have not shown any hate or anger towards you but your satirical tone is exactly what you are arguing against close minded individuals who think only there way is right.

    The quote has a full stop between the two sections and states 'and fear Allah' not 'or' fear Allah you can do both it is not an ultimatum.
    Secondly your understanding of the word Fear Allah is flawed, it is not a fear of if you do not kill the disbelievers or some weird BS its like the fear you have for you father or mother as a child, it is a relationship of love but you know if you do something wrong they will punish you.

    thirdly, you need to read the entire quran to understand certain quotes you pick.
    "It is better to be violent, if there is violence in our hearts" That is a quote from Ghandi, if I show that to someone who has never heard of Ghandi of course the reaction will be to see it as violent but we all know Ghandi is a man of peace and the full quote reads "It is better to be violent, if there is violence in our hearts, than to put on the cloak of nonviolence to cover impotence.".

    Finally, Again there are thousands of quotes you can choose from the Quran but i will show you how doing good is not harming disbelievers or cutting heads or whatever you think all muslims follow.

    "Those who spend in prosperity and adversity, and those who suppress anger and pardon men; and Allah loves those who do good." 3:135
    Suppressing anger and pardoning those who do wrong is considered doing good and Allah loves those who do good.

    Again:
    "So Allah gave them the reward of this world, as also an excellent reward of the next; and Allah loves those who do good." (Al Quran 3:149)

    Again
    "And who is better in faith than he who submits himself to Allah, and he is a doer of good, and follows the religion of Abraham, the upright? And Allah took Abraham for a special friend." (Al Quran 4:126)

    Doing Good in islam is living with a heart capable of pardoning men and suppressing anger and those are the ones who will be provided heaven.

    - - - Updated - - -

    Quote Originally Posted by Xarnix View Post
    Appealing to emotion. Kay.



    That's common knowledge. However, the people joining it are not exploiting it, they're the ones fooled by it and believe what they say.


    [Remember] when your Lord inspired to the angels, "I am with you, so strengthen those who have believed. I will cast terror into the hearts of those who disbelieved, so strike [them] upon the necks and strike from them every fingertip." Quran 8:12.

    You're telling me that it's not the text that supports violence?

    By the way, it's not the most brutal. Also this quote is right on par. It's exactly straight from the Quran. Don't make shit up bby.

    Ah yes this classic argument. I've heard this so many times, and it's bullshit. We're reading and understanding it loud and fuckin clear, that's why we have a valid response in all of our posts.


    http://quran.com/2/191
    http://quran.com/2/193
    Here's yet another.

    In case you want to call bullshit, read this. And I mean read it. Don't just spend 5 minutes looking through it. Read it.
    http://www.thereligionofpeace.com/qu...3-violence.htm

    Shall I go on?
    Please use the website properly there is a button above the quotes which say view context,

    the line before the one you have placed is:
    Fight in the way of Allah those who fight you but do not transgress. Indeed. Allah does not like transgressors.

    It is a quote about people who fight you not about killing non believers, it also says do not transgress, preaching do not do anything when fighting that goes against what God tells you.

    “God does not forbid you to be kind and equitable to those who have neither fought against your faith nor driven you out of your homes. In fact God loves the equitable.” Qur’an:60:8
    Those innocent people that terrorist kill claiming to be muslims has nothing to do with islam.

  11. #86
    Hunter Jr.'s Avatar
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    A Historical meaning of Jihad:
    Historically, Jihad means Holy War (Dharma Juddha in Bangla). For 1400 years, Muslims always understood the meaning of Jihad as Islamic Holy War. Every Islamic scholar, Mullah, maulana, Imam, etc., of the whole world will agree with this meaning of Jihad. Technically, Jihad is war against non-Muslims (Jihad al-kuffar or Jihad against disbeliever; and Jihad al-munafiqeen or Jihad against hypocrites) only, since Muslims are forbidden to fight the Muslims. Hundreds of books were written by the Islamic scholars (Islamic Chintabid) on Jihad and everybody unanimously used the word Jihad as the religious war called holy war (Dharma Juddha). In the Islamic history, more than 80% of the texts are filled with Holy War (Jihad). Early Islam was spread in the Arabian Peninsula solely by holy wars (Jihad). Islam was propagated as a religion by series of wars/battles –both defensive as well as Offensive. As many as 78 historic battles were fought by the Prophet Muhammad himself. And out of 78, only one (battle of ditch) was defensive war, and the rest were simply offensive wars. Did Muslim soldiers go to Syria, Iran, and Egypt to fight defensive war? What about those great historical BATTLES – Battle of Oho’d, Battle of Bad’r, Battle of Khayber, signing of peace-pacts such as “Hudaibya Peace Pact,” etc.? Were those wars fought with the so-called struggle only? Alternatively, were those wars fought with the heart-piercing sharpened swords?
    Prophet Mohammed and his successors initiated series of offensive wars against pagan Arabs, Jews, Christians, etc., to spread or to impose Islam by force as well as to seize the abundance (booty) of these lands. However, it was quite possible that there had been some small numbers of conversions by sheer greatness of Prophet himself or due to some other miracles. Nevertheless, a great majority was converted by force
    http://www.historynet.com/muhammad-t...or-prophet.htm

    It's obviously clear at this point that I should not need to go on, right?
    Quote Originally Posted by Johnnyk121 View Post
    you pick.
    Oh the greatness of insults. Yet another internet keyboard warrior, furiously typing away on his keyboard trying to insult me. Oh, shit. What am I to do now?

    Quote Originally Posted by robinvanpersie View Post
    Not every single verse that mentions the unbelievers is talking about all non-Muslims for any time period. It is only talking about the non-Muslims at that time, who were killing and oppressing people for simply being Muslim.
    It's clear that Muhammad led an offensive war. If you'd read a history book instead of a religious one, you would tell quite a difference.

    >History book written from 2000-2015
    >Religious book written by man that is ancient from thousands of years ago

    which one would you choose?

    - - - Updated - - -

    Quote Originally Posted by robinvanpersie View Post
    This is on a another level of crazy. Not even Daesh themselves are saying "they're getting prophecies from God."

    If you could only see how funny your posts are from a Muslims perspective. I suggest watching less anime and playing video games, and opening up some books on Islam and the life of the Prophet pbuh.
    YOU laughed? Using ad hominem in your arguments now, robin? Pathetic.

    I suggest reading a real book instead of a quran and learn the true Islam and the real life of the Prophet "pbuh". Empire's posts are spot the fuck on, you're just too unwilling or you can't understand it so you won't listen to them. You immediately reply with either copypasta'd bullshit or a bunch of fallacies that don't even make sense.
    Last edited by Hunter Jr.; 09-07-2015 at 11:28 AM.

  12. #87
    Empire's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by robinvanpersie View Post
    This is on a another level of crazy. Not even Daesh themselves are saying "they're getting prophecies from God."

    If you could only see how funny your posts are from a Muslims perspective. I suggest watching less anime and playing video games, and opening up some books on Islam and the life of the Prophet pbuh.
    If you can't even address what I say then don't respond. Attacking me because a profile pick only shows the frailty of your replies.

    Quote Originally Posted by robinvanpersie View Post
    Not every single verse that mentions the unbelievers is talking about all non-Muslims for any time period. It is only talking about the non-Muslims at that time, who were killing and oppressing people for simply being Muslim.

    That is why you don't take verses out of context and you read the Tafsirs which explains the verse. That website is biased and does not want you to understand Islam, it wants you to be ignorant. It is so obvious.
    You are correct, but it gives precedent. This will be used even if not intended in a way to justify war.

    An all-knowing god should have known that and Muhammad should have chose his words carefully.


  13. #88
    HelloThereChappy's Avatar
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    ...

    Quote Originally Posted by Jew View Post
    Muslims all over the world migrate to European countries because they are scared for their life in the countries they come from

    then after some time they feel comfortable in these countries and start to enforce the VERY THING that made them leave the country they came from.

    Muslims say islam is a religion of "peace" yet islam and peace are almost opposites.

    every place infested with the islamic movement is full of VIOLENCE

    Islam is the reason ISIS is beheading other people, not because they are radicals,but because THEY FOLLOW THE QURAN WORD BY WORD.

    the quran promotes murder,stoning and more horrible crimes - just like the bible and the new testament. but only 1 of these 3 books its followers take seriously. the quran of course

    Muslims aren't allowed free speech

    Its not allowed to draw Mohammed as if he is fucking offended if someone draws him

    Islam is the most stupid religion on the face of the earth.




    P.S

    Im an atheist and i acknowledge Christianity and Judaism is also retarded. but the retardation isnt violent
    ************************************************** ************************************
    Last edited by HelloThereChappy; 09-07-2015 at 01:07 PM.

  14. #89
    Hunter Jr.'s Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by HelloThereChappy View Post
    It is people like you that stop the world from evolving.
    1. In a literal term, the world does not evolve.
    2. In a realistic term, humans probably won't evolve again, because evolution takes place when survival is required. Adaptations to the species to fit where you are. There are 7,000,000,000 humans. We dominate the Earth. There's no need for the human race to evolve.
    3. And finally, RELIGION, is the thing stopping the world from moving forward. There are so many families that are kept dumb and astray from the modern world all from religion, not people who are debating it.

    Also you have not disproved any of Jew's VALID points.

    I'm guessing you don't even know what's in the other religious texts that are from Islam, like the Bukhari, since you seem to believe he hasn't read the Quran without mention of any other Islamic religious text.
    Last edited by Hunter Jr.; 09-07-2015 at 12:47 PM.

  15. #90
    HelloThereChappy's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Xarnix View Post
    1. In a literal term, the world does not evolve.
    2. In a realistic term, humans probably won't evolve again, because evolution takes place when survival is required. Adaptations to the species to fit where you are. There are 7,000,000,000 humans. We dominate the Earth. There's no need for the human race to evolve.
    3. And finally, RELIGION, is the thing stopping the world from moving forward. There are so many families that are kept dumb and astray from the modern world all from religion, not people who are debating it.

    Also you have not disproved any of Jew's SAGGY TITS points.
    ************************************************** **
    Last edited by HelloThereChappy; 09-07-2015 at 01:08 PM.

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