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  1. #1
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    Understanding Christianity

    Here are a couple of problems I have with the Christian faith. This thread is mostly addressed to coming to terms with a lot of Christians especially Sf0d. We have been having these debates lately so I decided to create a post where we can go at it without getting off topic. First of all, I shall post a bunch of errors, contradictions, illogical sayings from the bible itself. The reason why I am doing this is because Sf0d Claims Islam preaches a message of terrorism. Although, CLEARLY one who says this is not learned in his own Christianic religion.


    Cruxifiction:

    First of all, it is important to know that according to the New Testament itself, all of Jesus' Disciples fled for their lives on the night of crucifixion. None of them witnessed Jesus' crucifixion except for one, that is Saint Peter! He was the lone and only witness of the actual crucifixion event. Let us look at what the Bible's New Testament says:
    Matthew 26:34-35, 55-57, 69-75
    34 Jesus said unto him, Verily I say unto thee, That this night, before the cock crow, thou shalt deny me thrice.
    35 Peter said unto him, Though I should die with thee, yet will I not deny thee. Likewise also said all the disciples.
    .......
    55 In that same hour said Jesus to the multitudes, Are ye come out as against a thief with swords and staves for to take me? I sat daily with you teaching in the temple, and ye laid no hold on me.
    56 But all this was done, that the scriptures of the prophets might be fulfilled. Then all the disciples forsook him, and fled.
    57 And they that had laid hold on Jesus led him away to Caiaphas the high priest, where the scribes and the elders were assembled.
    69 Now Peter sat without in the palace: and a damsel came unto him, saying, Thou also wast with Jesus of Galilee.
    70 But he denied before them all, saying, I know not what thou sayest.
    71 And when he was gone out into the porch, another maid saw him, and said unto them that were there, This fellow was also with Jesus of Nazareth.
    72 And again he denied with an oath, I do not know the man.
    73 And after a while came unto him they that stood by, and said to Peter, Surely thou also art one of them; for thy speech bewrayeth thee.
    74 Then began he to curse and to swear, saying, I know not the man. And immediately the cock crew.
    75 And Peter remembered the word of Jesus, which said unto him, Before the cock crow, thou shalt deny me thrice. And he went out, and wept bitterly.

    Now as we clearly see, Peter did witness the so-called crucifixion event. He was present there. The only thing that saved him from death is his denial that he knew Jesus. Otherwise, he would've got crucified that night.

    Third Party Narrations:

    Let us also notice the third-party narration in the "Gospel of Matthew", and in the rest of the so-called "Gospels" of the New Testament. Here are few examples:
    "...And as Jesus passed forth thence, HE (Jesus) saw a man, named Matthew, sitting at the receipt of custom: and HE (Jesus) saith unto HIM (Matthew), follow ME (Jesus) and HE (Matthew) arose, and followed HIM (Jesus). (Matthew 9:9)"
    "And this is the record of John, when the Jews sent priests and Levites from Jerusalem to ask him, Who art thou? (From the King James Version Bible, John 1:19)"
    "John answered them, saying, I baptize with water: but there standeth one among you, whom ye know not; (From the King James Version Bible, John 1:26)"
    "For John was not yet cast into prison. (From the King James Version Bible, John 3:24)"

    Today's Books and Gospels' authors of the Bible are UNKNOWN. See the comments from the NIV Bible itself! Also includes detailed refutations and exposing of Paul's lies. See Paul's section in the article. It also includes proofs about the New Testament was written in the 3rd century by Constantine and his church by their own words. It wasn't written by Jesus and his original Disciples.

    Introduction: We must first of all know that the entire Bible is corrupted and unreliable and is mostly filled with man-made laws and corruption! "`How can you say, "We [the Jews] are wise, for we have the law of the LORD," when actually the lying pen of the scribes has handled it falsely?' (From the NIV Bible, Jeremiah 8:8)"
    The Revised Standard Version makes it even clearer: "How can you say, 'We are wise, and the law of the LORD is with us'? But, behold, the false pen of the scribes has made it (i.e., the bible) into a LIE. (From the RSV Bible, Jeremiah 8:8)"
    In either translation, we clearly see that the Jews had so much corrupted the Bible with their man-made cultural laws, that they had turned the Bible into a lie!
    See Also Deuteronomy 31:25-29 where Moses peace be upon him predicted the corruption/tampering of the Law (Bible) after his death.
    The Book of Moses predicted that the Law (Bible) will get corrupted. The Book of Jeremiah which came approximately 826 years after did indeed confirm this corruption.
    The Gospel of Mark:
    Note: This gospel is the oldest and supposedly the most original one in the New Testament!

    "Although there is no direct internal evidence of authorship, it was the unanimous testimony of the early church that this Gospel was written by John Mark. (From the NIV Bible Commentary, page 1488)"
    So, in reality, we don't really know whether Mark was the sole author of this Gospel or not. And since The New Testament wasn't even documented on paper until 150-300 years (depending on what Christian you talk to) after Jesus, then how are we to know for sure that the current "Gospel of Mark" wasn't written by some pro of Mark?
    If the "gospel of Mark" was indeed Divine and from GOD Almighty, then we wouldn't have this corruption, that they're admitting above, in it.

    I hope you see the real danger in making these assumptions when you are willing to DIE for the fact that such Gospel is the actual True Word of GOD Almighty!
    Further regarding this Gospel, we read the following commentary about Mark 16:9-20:
    "Serious doubts exists as to whether these verses belong to the Gospel of Mark. They are absent from important early manuscripts and display certain peculiarities of vocabulary, style and theological content that are unlike the rest of Mark. His Gospel probably ended at 16:8, or its original ending has been lost. (From the NIV Bible Foot Notes, page 1528)"
    This quote raises a very serious issue here. First of all, as we've seen above in the first quote, we have no evidence that proves that John Mark was the sole author of this so called "Gospel". Second of all, we see that this Gospel has some serious problems/suspicions in it. The issue of Mark 16:9-20 is a scary one, because many Christian cults today use poisonous snakes in their worship and end up dying.
    Removing Mark 16:9-20 is quite appreciated by me personally (to be quite honest with you), because it prevents people from dying from snake bites. But however, the serious issue of man's corruption of the Bible remains.
    We can be absolutely certain now that the above quotes prove without a doubt that the Bible is doubtful. The quote "or its original ending has been lost" proves that what we call today "Gospels" were not written by their original authors such as Mark, John, Matthew, etc... It proves that the Gospel had been tampered with by man. Let alone considering it as the True Living Words of GOD Almighty.
    If John Mark wasn't the one who wrote Mark 16:9-20, then who did? And how can you prove the ownership of the other person? Let alone proving that it was GOD Almighty's Revelation. And as we saw in the first quote above, we don't even know that John Mark was indeed the one who wrote the so called "Gospel of Mark".
    To say the least in our case here, we now have enough evidence to discard the entire Gospel of Mark from the Bible, because you can't take bits and pieces of it and say some of it belongs to him and some of it doesn't! Let alone considering the entire corrupted Gospel as the True Living Word of GOD Almighty, which is a complete blasphemy.

  2. #2
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    Terrorism in the Bible: What Benny Hinn loves to hide
    Cutting the hands and feet of the enemies in the Bible, and hanging their live bodies on trees until they DIE.



    "They fought against Midian, as the LORD commanded Moses, and killed every man........Now kill all the boys [innocent kids]. And kill every woman who has slept with a man, but save for yourselves every girl who has never slept with a man. (Numbers 31:7,17-18)"

    Kill everything that "breathes" from humans and animals!

    Deuteronomy 20:16
    However, in the cities of the nations the Lord your God is giving you as an inheritance, do not leave alive anything that breathes.

    Deuteronomy 20:16
    However, in the cities of the nations the Lord your God is giving you as an inheritance, do not leave alive anything that breathes.

    1 Samuel 15:2-4
    2 Thus saith the LORD of hosts, I remember that which Amalek did to Israel, how he laid wait for him in the way, when he came up from Egypt.
    3 Now go and smite Amalek, and utterly destroy all that they have, and spare them not; but slay both man and woman, infant and suckling, ox and sheep, camel and ass.
    4 And Saul gathered the people together, and numbered them in Telaim, two hundred thousand footmen, and ten thousand men of Judah.

    Psalm 137:8-9
    8 O daughter of Babylon, O destroyed one, O the happiness of him who repayeth to thee thy deed, That thou hast done to us.
    9 O the happiness of him who doth seize, And hath dashed thy sucklings on the rock!

    I find it to be absolutely ridiculous that the bible feeds us all kinds of lies and contradictions about "love your enemy", and yet, we see mass slaughter of suckling infants and innocent boys, girls, unarmed men, women (old and young), and innocent domestic farm animals by the tens of thousands! It is clear that the inconsistent man-altered, man-corrupted and morally corrupt bible is nothing but a false book, and can not be a Divine and Perfect Holy Book!


    As shown in the quotes below:
    "....The Tannaïtic Midrash Sifre to Numbers in §157 comments on the above quoted commandment of MOSES to kill the Midianite women as well as the male children...."

    "....According to the Tannaïte Rabbis, MOSES therefore had ordered the Israelites to kill all women older than three years and a day, because they were "suitable for having sexual relations." [138]...."

    "Said Rabbi Joseph, "Come and take note: A girl three years and one day old is betrothed by intercourse....."

    "A girl three years and one day old is betrothed by intercourse. "A girl three years old may be betrothed th
    "They fought against Midian, as the LORD commanded Moses, and killed every man........Now kill all the boys [innocent kids]. And kill every woman who has slept with a man, but save for yourselves every girl who has never slept with a man. (Numbers 31:7,17-18)"

    Since the only females left fit for marriage and wholesome relations were prepubescent virgins, a Jewish law concerning child marriage was enacted. That law is found in the Babylonian Talmud:

    "Rabbi Joseph said, 'Come and hear. A maiden aged 3 years and a day may be acquired in marriage by coition.'

    Mishnah: A girl of the age of 3 years and a day may be betrothed, subject to her father's approval, by sexual intercourse.

    Gemara: Our Rabbis taught: 'A girl of the age of 3 years may be betrothed by sexual intercourse.' "


    Numbers 31:35-40 "[From the captives of war] 32,000 women who had never slept with a man.......of which the tribute for the LORD was 32 [among them were virgin girls]."

  3. #3
    gunot's Avatar
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    all relgisons are bullshit if you dont know that till now your stupid

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    Do as the good book tells you and let it go. If he wants to follow his own beliefs... thats his choice. Drop it. I'm frankly sick of the bickering between you two. He believes what he believes.. you believe what you believe. End of story. Who's the bigger man? Walk away.

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    My God you are dumb.

    Matthew 16:21 - From that time on Jesus began to explain to his disciples that he must go to Jerusalem and suffer many things at the hands of the elders, chief priests, and teachers of the law, and that he must be killed and on the third day be raised to life.

    Luke 18:31,32 - Jesus took the twelve aside and told them, 'We are going up to Jerusalem, and everything that is written by the prophets about the Son of Man will be fulfilled. He will be handed over to the Gentiles, they will mock him, insult him, spit on him, flog him, and kill him. On the third day he will rise again.'

    John 12:30-32 - This voice was for your benefit, not mine. Now is the time for judgment on this world; now the prince of this world will be driven out. But I, when I am lifted up from the earth, will draw all men to myself". He said this to show the kind of death he was going to die.

    Also the war in the Bible is retaliation or command of God. With the Jew's winning against bad odds they see that God is truly for them.

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    The verses you posted are not benefitial at all... they prove nothing. The war was not retaliation. I recall reading that God gave Palestine to Abraham it was known as the "promised land." Go commanded the children of Israel to attack the filistines. Now, even if it was retaliation... God commanding people to murder childrn? Rape women? Destroy any sinners??? Bash newborn babies on rocks.... thats not retaliation its terrorism!!! Also, EndriT prove to me religion is bullshit? Prove to me that God is unexsitant. Again death this was a debate adressed to Sf0d after his violent ranting about Islam. I wanted to bring some equality to the table and question his own beliefs. I know, I am not forcing anything down his throat for that is wrong but I want to adress a small matter of his hypocricy.

  7. #7
    sf0d's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by jeehad View Post
    The verses you posted are not benefitial at all... they prove nothing. The war was not retaliation. I recall reading that God gave Palestine to Abraham it was known as the "promised land." Go commanded the children of Israel to attack the filistines. Now, even if it was retaliation... God commanding people to murder childrn? Rape women? Destroy any sinners??? Bash newborn babies on rocks.... thats not retaliation its terrorism!!! Also, EndriT prove to me religion is bullshit? Prove to me that God is unexsitant. Again death this was a debate adressed to Sf0d after his violent ranting about Islam. I wanted to bring some equality to the table and question his own beliefs. I know, I am not forcing anything down his throat for that is wrong but I want to adress a small matter of his hypocricy.
    My god you are damn stupid, that proves the Crucifixion, but of course you only believe that the quran is right. Seriously man, he can't copy stuff down from the OT right, but ofc "corrupt" they changed it cause they wanted it the quran to look corrupt right?

    "Zaid bin Thabit, the Ansari said, 'Abu Bakr sent for me after the (heavy) casualties among the warriors (of the battle) of Yamama (where a great number of Muhammad’s Companions were killed). Umar was present with Bakr. "The people have suffered heavy casualties at Yamama, and I am afraid that there will be more casualties among those who can recite the Qur'an on other battlefields. A large part of the Qur'an may be lost unless you collect it." I replied to Umar, "How can I do something which Allah’s Apostle has not done?" Umar kept on pressing, trying to persuade me to accept his proposal.’ Zaid bin Thabit added, 'Umar was sitting with Abu Bakr and was speaking (to) me. "You are a wise young man and we do not suspect you of telling lies or of forgetfulness. You used to write the Divine Inspiration for Allah’s Apostle. Therefore, look for the Qur'an and collect it (in one manuscript)." By Allah, if Abu Bakr had ordered me to shift one of the mountains (from its place) it would have been easier for me than the collection of the Qur'an. I said to both of them, "How dare you do a thing which the Prophet has not done?"

    Hard to collect the collection of the Quran? Some of it could have been left out making it CORRUPT. Yes its from Hadiths, unlike Muslims Christians dont just throw out something.

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    Unlike the Bible the quran was written and documented as soon as it was revealed. In fact, we have Copies of the quran in turkish museums where anybody can go and see them which are identical to the modern ones. They are unchanged!!! On the other hand, the NT was written down about 150 yeasr after the death of Jesus thats even after roman pesecution of the Christians by burning alot of authentic documents of the bible. Eventually, authors got together and collected he said/she said words into a modern copy of the bible lead by a facist leader known as cosntantine. You call me dumb but yet you have no knowledge of the bibles own history:P Secondly, I know the Bible claims that Jesus died on the cross. BUT, the claims it makes are third person he said/she said views. In fact there are many other verses which hint that he is alive. According to peter, he heard someone tell him about the cruxifiction. Remember, the bible said that all the disicples fled INCLUDING PETER! So, how do we know if the word is actually truthful? Your misunderstanding my point here. Lol... The Christians threw otu THOUSANDS of verses from the bible because the stories were unreal..They argued Christian logic.... In fact the Gospel of Barnabys and Enoch was actually included until the late 40's where the church decided to give it a boot. Hadiths are like books. Sometimes you agree with them sometimes you dont! See, we dont consider the hadiths divine there just ways of understanding the path that people lived in. They are just understand the way of living in a pious manner. Unlike Christianity, we dont change our CENTRAL BOOK OF RELIGIOUS BELIEF. The Quran has remained untampered and unchanged for centuries!! and here is proof!


    Heres an article and proof of Quranic preservation.

    http://www.answering-christianity.com/quran/textual.htm
    Last edited by jeehad; 04-28-2007 at 01:49 PM.

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    too much text to read >_<

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    Quote Originally Posted by farhad View Post
    too much text to read >_<
    it's nice to see that people are willing to write essays just to prove that they are right...

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    The debate is mostly aimed for Sf0d lol. If you choose to read it then do so but its a debate so its optional.

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    sf0d is a moron.. and trust me a muslim to a muslim... drop it... think how good it woud be if ARBAS COUD NOT GIVE A FUCK WAHT OTHER PEPOLE THINK ABOUT ISLAM BUT NOOOOO ...............

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    LooL Well...... I do care what people think about my religion. I want to show people that Islam is not what the media intends on it to being. Islam is a truthful message of love and peace, and if Sf0d doesnt get that then at least I tried eh.

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    Quote Originally Posted by jeehad View Post
    LooL Well...... I do care what people think about my religion. I want to show people that Islam is not what the media intends on it to being. Islam is a truthful message of love and peace, and if Sf0d doesnt get that then at least I tried eh.

    and thats your problem...... and leave sf0d be he will just make us mad.. his a fucking moron who dosent understand shit.......and islam has some good points and some really dumb.. but you cant get everything cant you?... and anway just to let you know all religons = bunch of bullshit..

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    Quote Originally Posted by EndriT View Post
    and thats your problem...... and leave sf0d be he will just make us mad.. his a fucking moron who dosent understand shit.......and islam has some good points and some really dumb.. but you cant get everything cant you?... and anway just to let you know all religons = bunch of bullshit..
    brother endrit the quran states facts which are happening and some i can c happening and the events quran stated are hard to mis out in the events tht are occurring and will occur

    PS: to all muslims holy struggle has come lets help out our brothers and sisters all over the world lets not let the New World Order fuck us not just muslims all of the human race

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