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  1. #16
    Paroxysm's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by azneaglez View Post
    Lol we have a Creation Evolution Project that counts for every class in the fourth quarter
    wow, where do you go to school?
    "We swallow greedily any lie that flatters us, but we sip only little by little at a truth we find bitter." ~ Denis Diderot

  2. #17
    Empire's Avatar
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    *bang*

    done.


  3. #18
    NextGen1's Avatar
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    ....The Big Bang theory of the universe is False.....Nothing more then a diluted theory derived from someone else trying to understand their own existence.

    Some of the most intelligent minds have some of the silliest theories,

    The cosmological red shift is due to the compton effect not the the doppler effect, which only supports the Big Bang Theory as a load of crap....

    as far as creation goes......and our existence, Lets talk statistical probability

    We were created by something much larger then ourselves

    The first law of thermodynamics says that energy cannot be created....Ever... It can only be changed.

    In our own universe anything with the probability of less then one in 10 to the 100th power has a "Zero Chance Factor" Meaning cannot occur by chance.

    Mr. Salisbury has calculated the probability of a typical DNA chain arising or being created "by chance to be" 1 in every 10 to the 600th power.

    for those still learning basic math, thats 10 with 600 zero's

    Code:
    10000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000
    DNA is the building block of our life and our existence, and it has a zero probability of occurring by chance.................

    Mr. Mike Stubbs once calculated the chance of insulin ( a very important protein hormone) developing on it's own by chance at 1 in 3x10 to the 158th power

    thats 3 x 10 with 158 0's at the end of it.

    So by mathematical and scientific standards, Our creation could not have happened by chance.
    Last edited by NextGen1; 03-05-2010 at 12:25 AM.


     


     


     



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  4. #19
    Empire's Avatar
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    just fuel the fire.


  5. #20
    NextGen1's Avatar
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    Everything said in this thread is going to be fuel to the fire


     


     


     



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  6. #21
    why06's Avatar
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    Hmm***. The big bang is a theory meant to describe not only the creation of the universe but more importantly the time frame, consistencies of matter. Currently the Universe is seen to be expanding uniformly in all directions. There was noticed redshift in galaxies which provides much evidence for the expansion. More importantly the Big Bang model explains Cosmic background radiation like no other model can. The Big Bang is the natural reverse engineering of the Universe based on our current observation. Nothing more and nothing less. Does it mean anything really though o_O? Probably not. Its just saying that the universe formed at a central point and expanded other then simply always existing or coming together...

    EDIT: hmmm... never heard of this Compton effect though. Interesting, but unless this compton effect can prove the universe is in fact stationary and not expanding (faster then the speed of light for that matter) then The Big Bang will stand as it also explains CMBR.
    Last edited by why06; 03-05-2010 at 12:38 AM.

    "Every gun that is made, every warship launched, every rocket fired signifies, in the final sense, a theft from those who hunger and are not fed, those who are cold and are not clothed. This world in arms is not spending money alone. It is spending the sweat of its laborers, the genius of its scientists, the hopes of its children. The cost of one modern heavy bomber is this: a modern brick school in more than 30 cities. It is two electric power plants, each serving a town of 60,000 population. It is two fine, fully equipped hospitals. It is some fifty miles of concrete pavement. We pay for a single fighter plane with a half million bushels of wheat. We pay for a single destroyer with new homes that could have housed more than 8,000 people. This is, I repeat, the best way of life to be found on the road the world has been taking. This is not a way of life at all, in any true sense. Under the cloud of threatening war, it is humanity hanging from a cross of iron."
    - Dwight D. Eisenhower

  7. #22
    Paroxysm's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by NextGen1 View Post
    ....The Big Bang theory of the universe is False.....Nothing more then a diluted theory derived from someone else trying to understand their own existence.

    Some of the most intelligent minds have some of the silliest theories,

    The cosmological red shift is due to the compton effect not the the doppler effect, which only supports the Big Bang Theory as a load of crap....

    as far as creation goes......and our existence, Lets talk statistical probability

    We were created by something much larger then ourselves

    The first law of thermodynamics says that energy cannot be created....Ever... It can only be changed.

    In our own universe anything with the probability of less then one in 10 to the 100th power has a "Zero Chance Factor" Meaning cannot occur by chance.

    Mr. Frank Salisbury has calculated the probability of a typical DNA chain arising "by chance to be" 1 in every 10 to the 600th power.

    for those still learning basic math, thats 10 with 600 zero's

    Code:
    10000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000
    DNA is the building block of our life and our existence, and it has a zero probability of occurring by chance.................

    Mr. Mike Stubbs once calculated the chance of insulin ( a very important protein hormone) developing on it's own by chance at 1 in 3x10 to the 158th power

    thats 3 x 10 with 158 0's at the end of it.

    So by mathematical and scientific standards, Our creation could not have happened by chance.

    Sigh...

    Sometimes I wonder if arguing with creationists is even worth my time.

    1. Statistical arguments are a waste of air, there are nearly an infinite amount of possibilities that can occur at any moment, that makes a specific moment infinitely less likely to have occurred, but it does. By the way your not impressing anyone with scientific notation.


    The cosmological red shift is due to the compton effect not the the doppler effect, which only supports the Big Bang Theory as a load of crap....
    Cite a credible source.

    2. Right about here I'm gonna stop being polite. Your a fucking idiot. Here's a crazy notion, NO MATTER HOW STATISTICALLY UNLIKELY AN EVENT IS TO HAVE OCCURRED, IT'S PROBABILITY OF HAVING OCCURRED THROUGH A SUPERNATURAL AGENCY IS INFINITELY LESS LIKELY.


    Creationists: Can't live with them, can totally live without them.


    Here's a little heads up, don't bother posting anything by Kent Hovind, Ken Ham, Ray Comfort, Kirk Cameron or any one connected to the Discovery Institute. Because I'll just start laughing at you.




    PS.
    We don't know everything about the universe, we don't anywhere near everything about the universe, get fucking used to it.
    Last edited by Paroxysm; 03-05-2010 at 12:34 AM.
    "We swallow greedily any lie that flatters us, but we sip only little by little at a truth we find bitter." ~ Denis Diderot

  8. #23
    Empire's Avatar
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    Point being:

    None of you know shit about the creation of the universe, your just taking a guess.


  9. #24
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    Quote Originally Posted by Empire View Post
    Point being:

    None of you know shit about the creation of the universe, your just taking a guess.
    Thats what you would call a hypothesis. It's science an educated guess that can be supported with facts and dis-proven if need be.

    "Every gun that is made, every warship launched, every rocket fired signifies, in the final sense, a theft from those who hunger and are not fed, those who are cold and are not clothed. This world in arms is not spending money alone. It is spending the sweat of its laborers, the genius of its scientists, the hopes of its children. The cost of one modern heavy bomber is this: a modern brick school in more than 30 cities. It is two electric power plants, each serving a town of 60,000 population. It is two fine, fully equipped hospitals. It is some fifty miles of concrete pavement. We pay for a single fighter plane with a half million bushels of wheat. We pay for a single destroyer with new homes that could have housed more than 8,000 people. This is, I repeat, the best way of life to be found on the road the world has been taking. This is not a way of life at all, in any true sense. Under the cloud of threatening war, it is humanity hanging from a cross of iron."
    - Dwight D. Eisenhower

  10. #25
    Empire's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by why06 View Post
    Thats what you would call a hypothesis. It's science an educated guess that can be supported with facts and dis-proven if need be.
    but in the end its just a guess.


  11. #26
    CyberGenius's Avatar
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    lol i made the universe from my anus!

  12. #27
    Paroxysm's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Empire View Post


    but in the end its just a guess.
    Ummmm no.

    A guess:
    Empire doesn't understand the scientific method and is taking epistemology to an unpragmatic length.


    "We swallow greedily any lie that flatters us, but we sip only little by little at a truth we find bitter." ~ Denis Diderot

  13. #28
    Empire's Avatar
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    paroxysm, i understand the scientific method, and i understand why you think proving a point matters.

    but in the end, no one knows for sure. Thats a fact.


  14. #29
    NextGen1's Avatar
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    @ Parox

    This isn't (for me) a religious debate, This isn't about my beliefs or disbeliefs, it is merely (by most means) a argument against creation as a occurrence of chance.

    You base everything you do (subconsciously or otherwise) on statistical probability, I am sure you have walked through a thunderstorm in the park, and thought to yourself, "I will be safe" but you believe this because in any given year, the probability of being struck by lightning is only 1 in 750,000

    Such a small gamble in comparison, don't you think?

    so the fact that Morowitz of Yale University, has come to the mathematical probability that the odds of life creating itself by chance are 1 in 10 followed by....... one billion zeroes......... which gives it a Zero Chance of occurring....and that holds no bearing, but with your life, your willing to gamble on one in 750,000 Or on the probability that you will not be hit by a car when you walk across the street.

    every occurrence in existence can be calculated with mathematical equastions. Fact is subconsciously , we do the same thing everyday, and I am not willing to throw out the idea of a GOD , especially when science cannot prove or disprove it, and with the the Facts Piling against "Chance" as a possibility, what is left....

    Bare in mind, it's not just the one probability, the actual probability only decreases when you factor in, DNA and it's probability of existing solely by chance , and now you begin factoring in the probability of any prerequisite for life occurring by chance, and you are no longer looking at a sole probability, but more of a improbability.

    If for some strange reason, you thought you were the only person in existence, and you stepped out your hut, and you seen a shiny car about a block away from you, as a logical thinker you would have to assume it was either created by someone, or appeared by chance.... I assume that is correct..to say...

    Well, If it got there solely by chance , then one would have to assume it's origin is no different then the origin of the trees around you. But if you were to begin an examination of the car, you would notice the car has functionality, moving parts... the moving parts would lead a logical thinker as yourself to the conclusion, it must have been created.

    Even though you think you are the only person in the world (in my analogy) and you can't see anyone else around, you still come to the conclusion that this must have been created... By someone or something, It could not have happened by chance, and scientifically, it is impossible.

    Now consider the complexity of the universe, it is a million times more complex then that car... yet you can believe the it occurred by chance....

    Your argument is almost self refuting.

    as far as citing a reliable source, Grote Reber is a renowned astronomer....


    @ Empire, You are right, there is no real way of knowing.....


     


     


     



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  15. #30
    Paroxysm's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Empire View Post
    paroxysm, i understand the scientific method, and i understand why you think proving a point matters.

    but in the end, no one knows for sure. Thats a fact.
    Well then "know" is a useless word if you frame it that way. I'm a pragmatist and your definition of "know" serves no purpose and thus is useless. Quit mucking up the waters.
    "We swallow greedily any lie that flatters us, but we sip only little by little at a truth we find bitter." ~ Denis Diderot

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