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  1. #16
    DєfKOniK's Avatar
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    Nah, its all physics. In a perfect environment we can roll a dice and know what it would be.

  2. #17
    maximon555's Avatar
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    Well according to Albert Einstein the past, present, and future all exist simultaneously.Wouldn't that also mean our actions are predetermined ?

  3. #18
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    Quote Originally Posted by Dave84311 View Post


    Why can't randomness exist in physics? I made the decision to reply to your thread, and replied as I did. I could have responded to it in any million ways, with any million choice of words. Did physics somehow determine what I said and how I said it, because... well you know everything revolves around physics.
    Because everything always takes the path of least resistance. If a particle is staring down path and A and B, it's always going to take the A path, even if it could choose B, how would it be able to? There's no dice rolling in it choosing it and computing it. If it didn't always take the path of least resistance, on the quantum level, we would have freak occurrences. In the quantum world, everything moves with absolute precision. The "random walk" of electrons may appear to random, but based on my reasoning before, I highly doubt it, more or less minuscule resistance changes on a wire, from other electrons, magnetic field fluxes, and other microscopic quantum forces.

    I believe there's something different which makes a living thing tick, which is why we can have in my opinion, spontaneous randomness, consciousness, etc. Perhaps I'm wrong, there is no randomness in living things, and we can create perfectly artificial life that is the exact same as us, with a conscious being occupying the creation. Hell, maybe 200 years from now, they can perfectly reconstruct our brain and bring us back from the dead? If there's nothing really special about us "conscious beings", what would happen if your perfectly equivalent brain was cloned and existed at the same time? Would we have a shared consciousness and be seeing out of two sets of eyes in the universe, acting like a multi-core computer? Or would someone else occupy that brain that thinks exactly like you, but some other conscious being is occupying that brain that has your brain. CREEPYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYY. Hell, maybe we are just here for the ride looking out like a television tube, and there is no choices by the being made by you being conscious, it is all part of your brain's reasoning?
    Last edited by arunforce; 07-24-2012 at 12:59 PM.



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  4. #19
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    is fate exists then everything you do to go against your 'fate' will still be part of your fate...

    paradox.
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  5. #20
    radnomguywfq3's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by arunforce View Post


    Because everything always takes the path of least resistance. If a particle is staring down path and A and B, it's always going to take the A path, even if it could choose B, how would it be able to? There's no dice rolling in it choosing it and computing it. If it didn't always take the path of least resistance, on the quantum level, we would have freak occurrences. In the quantum world, everything moves with absolute precision. The "random walk" of electrons may appear to random, but based on my reasoning before, I highly doubt it, more or less minuscule resistance changes on a wire, from other electrons, magnetic field fluxes, and other microscopic quantum forces.

    I believe there's something different which makes a living thing tick, which is why we can have in my opinion, spontaneous randomness, consciousness, etc. Perhaps I'm wrong, there is no randomness in living things, and we can create perfectly artificial life that is the exact same as us, with a conscious being occupying the creation. Hell, maybe 200 years from now, they can perfectly reconstruct our brain and bring us back from the dead? If there's nothing really special about us "conscious beings", what would happen if your perfectly equivalent brain was cloned and existed at the same time? Would we have a shared consciousness and be seeing out of two sets of eyes in the universe, acting like a multi-core computer? Or would someone else occupy that brain that thinks exactly like you, but some other conscious being is occupying that brain that has your brain. CREEPYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYY. Hell, maybe we are just here for the ride looking out like a television tube, and there is no choices by the being made by you being conscious, it is all part of your brain's reasoning?
    What he said.



    There are two types of tragedies in life. One is not getting what you want, the other is getting it.

    If you wake up at a different time in a different place, could you wake up as a different person?


  6. #21
    Bernard.'s Avatar
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    But fate is what you do can't change it, do one thing its fate, do the opposite, its fate. EVERYTHING IS FATE
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  7. #22
    Gragodine's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Jetamay View Post
    Benjamin Libet also proved that our brain responds to muscle movements before we make the continuous decision to move these muscles. I.e, when we move our fingers, we haven't yet continuously decided to do so. That infact, we only become aware of this movement several moments after our fingers begin moving.
    There is a very simple explanation to this.
    For reasons of survival humans developed so that muscle movements are made before we are conscious of us deciding to move that finger.
    Its a bit like how reflexes happen. There's a part of your brain in charge of movement that is separate from your conscious part.
    Think of it like lag between computer parts.
    Shit job of explaining i guess.
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  8. #23
    radnomguywfq3's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Gragodine View Post
    There is a very simple explanation to this.
    For reasons of survival humans developed so that muscle movements are made before we are conscious of us deciding to move that finger.
    Its a bit like how reflexes happen. There's a part of your brain in charge of movement that is separate from your conscious part.
    Think of it like lag between computer parts.
    Shit job of explaining i guess.
    Well thats one of the believed reasons, afaik there is still a large controversy about it.



    There are two types of tragedies in life. One is not getting what you want, the other is getting it.

    If you wake up at a different time in a different place, could you wake up as a different person?


  9. #24
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    Quote Originally Posted by Jetamay View Post
    Well thats one of the believed reasons, afaik there is still a large controversy about it.
    I believe the explanation is quite simple. We may lift our hands, fingers, etc by using our subconscious to just perform said action, yet our nervous system still needs to relay the information to the muscles on doing said action. Our conscious is telling us "walk" but the entire concept behind walking is first instigated in our subconscious as "right leg forward left leg forward" and etc. our subconscious beig the processing power behind the actual action then needs to relay the information to the individual muscle through electrical bursts known as a synapse. These synapses are related through chemical excretion from the individual nerve all the way from the brain down the spinal chord to the individual nerve that is in command of said muscle. Though the response is extremely quick, there will still be a delay from the brain to the nerve in charge of said muscle. Our subconscious merely acts as a lag compensation program in this aspect.

  10. #25
    Gragodine's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Lehsyrus View Post


    I believe the explanation is quite simple. We may lift our hands, fingers, etc by using our subconscious to just perform said action, yet our nervous system still needs to relay the information to the muscles on doing said action. Our conscious is telling us "walk" but the entire concept behind walking is first instigated in our subconscious as "right leg forward left leg forward" and etc. our subconscious beig the processing power behind the actual action then needs to relay the information to the individual muscle through electrical bursts known as a synapse. These synapses are related through chemical excretion from the individual nerve all the way from the brain down the spinal chord to the individual nerve that is in command of said muscle. Though the response is extremely quick, there will still be a delay from the brain to the nerve in charge of said muscle. Our subconscious merely acts as a lag compensation program in this aspect.
    Quite an excellent job of explaining.
    .Gragtastic.
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  11. #26
    radnomguywfq3's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Lehsyrus View Post


    I believe the explanation is quite simple. We may lift our hands, fingers, etc by using our subconscious to just perform said action, yet our nervous system still needs to relay the information to the muscles on doing said action. Our conscious is telling us "walk" but the entire concept behind walking is first instigated in our subconscious as "right leg forward left leg forward" and etc. our subconscious beig the processing power behind the actual action then needs to relay the information to the individual muscle through electrical bursts known as a synapse. These synapses are related through chemical excretion from the individual nerve all the way from the brain down the spinal chord to the individual nerve that is in command of said muscle. Though the response is extremely quick, there will still be a delay from the brain to the nerve in charge of said muscle. Our subconscious merely acts as a lag compensation program in this aspect.
    I never stated whether or not I agreed with you.

    I don't really take a stance on that because I haven't read too much in to it. What I have read is that is that there are alot of opposing arguments and controversy on that particular discovery, neither argument has been proven. I was simply stating that what you said is not fact but rather one of the arguments.

    *edit*
    And as to inject some bias, what you said is similar to what I expected when I read the wiki.
    Last edited by radnomguywfq3; 07-27-2012 at 05:18 PM.



    There are two types of tragedies in life. One is not getting what you want, the other is getting it.

    If you wake up at a different time in a different place, could you wake up as a different person?


  12. #27
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    Quote Originally Posted by Jetamay View Post
    I never stated whether or not I agreed with you.

    I don't really take a stance on that because I haven't read too much in to it. What I have read is that is that there are alot of opposing arguments and controversy on that particular discovery, neither argument has been proven. I was simply stating that what you said is not fact but rather one of the arguments.

    *edit*
    And as to inject some bias, what you said is similar to what I expected when I read the wiki.
    No I know I was just explaining why the brains cognitive response is delayed to that of the mental imagery

  13. #28
    CheapShizz's Avatar
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    Exellent question..

    You decide your fate.
    AS simple as that

  14. #29
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    Quote Originally Posted by Dave84311 View Post


    Why can't randomness exist in physics? I made the decision to reply to your thread, and replied as I did. I could have responded to it in any million ways, with any million choice of words. Did physics somehow determine what I said and how I said it, because... well you know everything revolves around physics.
    off topic now stfu DAVE

  15. #30
    S|W|P's Avatar
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    Well I think fate exist I met a couple of people who I can use very good for some jobs and stuff I think fate brought us on eachothers ways

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