Tsk, Tsk, Nexon.

Nobody is asking you to release anything...and since it's just your personal project that you are doing for yourself, why come here and post about it at all? Knock yourself out creating all the private hacks you want, but as far as me and everybody else is concerned, keep it to yourself, we really have no interest in your private personal projects. FYI I don't need your hack.

I may not be a hardcore vindictus hacker, but I do create custom roms for android phones. The difference is, my stable projects that i spend hours on for nothing in return except self satisfaction gets released to all instead of just posting in the forums saying "look what i made, oh and by the way you can't have it"

This thread belong in the "Help" section under "I need attention, help me!"

I believe it's North Korea's fault.

Also..guys I want this to be the last comment on the "derailed" part of the thread.

There's multiple kinds of coders in the world, but we'll go with 2 different kinds of coders on MPGH and other sites.

1 "The Sharing Coder"

This coder possibly started off as a normal user that tried out a few game hacks, then became interested in coding hacks for games.

This person shares the information with the community, because they love sharing information, or because they want to just have fun with friends, ect..no matter the actual specific reason..

They share because they WANT to.

Downsides:

The hacks can be patched rather quickly, not JUST because 12302192312x people are using them, but because ANYONE can download them, including the employees of that video-game company.

Now, while most of us have limited knowledge on de-compilation, ect. There are people that work at game companies that know exactly how to rip apart .dll files, decrypt them, ect..and look at the source code.

This allows them to patch the issue, or make a detection for the method that is exploited, and the ban waves come out. Contrary to popular belief that anti-hack systems magically detect code..they do not normally.

VAC aka Valve Anti-Cheat is notorious for slapping out random ban waves, but the only way they normally "detect" that you've been hacking is by detecting the method that was used to hack. I've seen many instances where a user was banned, then emails customer support with some "new" hacks that aren't detected, and then they become unbanned by valve. Then the new hacks are detected, and more people's days are ruined.

Sad, but true.

GG, HS, XOR, ect. Game Guard, Hack Shield, and the other guys.

Any true coder will tell you that these anti-cheats are pieces of trash and trivial to bypass.

Back in the day you used sandboxie to simply bypass them, and as the times changed, so did methods..(some).

Downgrade the revision of GG, set up a fake auth server, ect.. All things done in honor of MS/Pangya..and other games, in order to allow YOU the END USER, to keep cheating.

The main way these Anti-Cheat programs can detect you again, is by a user manually updating the detection rules. Sure there's always other ways of anti-cheat to detect you..(Screen Shots, ect.) but in all reality their user comes onto these forums, downloads the hack, and patches the game/sets up detection rule and then the CODER has to update the method.

Now that we have a understanding on WHY PUBLIC HACKS DO NOT LAST LONG..let's move to our 2nd coder shall we?

2. The Private/Paid Coder

This person has the same, or more knowledge than the Free Coder (All depends on the person) about the game they are hacking, and hacking in general.

Most of the time, but not always..this person has a AFK(IRL) job in the programming industry, network security industry, or computer/science related.

Why do they charge for hacks?

They charge for hacks for multiple reasons:

1. Private hacks have a lower change of detection because not many users get their hands on them. The higher the price, the lower chance anyone else uses it, and the more likely that you will not be banned, and the more likely the method will not be patched.

2. They know and understand that free hacks do not last long, and that the Free Coder NEVER..I MEAN NEVER gets the PROPER THANKS AND RESPECT THAT THEY DESERVE. How do I know that? Take a look at the downloads of ANY given hack, vs the actual words of thanks..not simply hitting the button..but taking the time out to comment on the work, provide feedback, and let the coder know you give a damn about them.

Asking for updates..is NOT thanking the coder..asking bad questions is NOT helpful to the coder..but telling them WHY you like their work, providing encouragement to them, and treating them like a ACTUAL PERSON instead of your free hack ticket goes a LONG way.

^ The lack of the above forces coders to not share/make their hacks paid, so only people that truly care about their work can access it. Don't like it? Make a change in the community, and change yourself.

3. It's their job. There are some coders that are EXCLUSIVELY game hack coders, and that's how they make their living, and by buying their work,you are keeping them fed, clothed, ect. This allows for a fully reciprocal relationship between the coder and user, from which both mutually benefit.

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These are not all the reasons, but they are some of the main ones.

Feel free to correct me if I'm wrong on these..and by wrong I mean Factually and blatantly wrong.

So you can either PAY for a hack that May or may not be higher quality than the free hacks, MAY OR MAY NOT get you banned.

NOTHING IS 100% UNDETECTABLE We all know this to be fact..if you don't..you should wise up very quickly. I've seen high quality private hacks that I, myself..have written get detected. It took 3 years yes..but it STILL CAN HAPPEN. It has a bit to do with "how good" your coding is, but it also has everything to do with "how active and effective" their GM/MOD/ADMIN community is.

Finally on the gigantic wall of text, because it SEEMS to be a issue here in MULTIPLE sections..let's go over a quick overview of attitudes.

Coder Attitudes

Some coders seem to be like they're rude, full of themselves..assholes..ect.

Well my friend, when you've been in the computer industry as long as I have, you meet many people like that.

Many times they aren't bad people, but they've been hurt many times in one way or another. They've been unappreciated, used, trash talked, ect..to the point where they have had ENOUGH.

They don't care really what you think now, because if you were "as good as them" you would be able to do x,y,z. While it may suck to see/hear that..it's kind of true.

If you really dislike that person and want to prove that their hack isn't all that good..then how about YOU pick up a few books on C++, Pearl, VB, Cryptography, ect..and then Write your own hack. It is NOT that hard if you are willing to dedicate time and effort into what you want to do. On that note..nothing is that hard if you're willing to learn it.

Does that coder share his/her work?

YES! They share their work with other coders that they find acceptable, on the same level of their intelligence, mainly to compare methods, workarounds, ect. Just because they don't share with you doesn't mean they won't share with anyone else..so again..sorry if you're on the outside, but only YOU can change that.

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Why should I listen to what YOU have to say on the subject?

Well that's a good question if you're contemplating that. I do have a very low post count at this point, mainly because I just read the forums, and contact people of interest outside of them, if they have that contact information available.

Qualifications to speak:

I graduated highschool at 16, went straight to college and attained an Associates of Science in Computer Information Technology, with a specialization in Network Security. By the time I was 18 I had my CCNP (Certified Cisco Networking Professional) certificate, and started to dabble into game hacking.

Working in the computer industry for a while teaches you a lot about the people that reside there, and also browsing tons of forums over all kinds of topics shows you the general feel of the users/moderators that exist on them also.

Soon after, I did realize that I did not want to sit behind a computer desk the rest of my life, and went back to college to attain a Bachelors degree in Chemistry.

I am 23 now, and attending college to attain my Masters Degree in Polymer Chemistry, then will be traveling abroad to begin work on my Doctorate (PHD). I have a family, and am a real person just like every one of you here.

I plan to work with nanotechnology to attempt to research cures for cancer, genetic defects, hpv, and to "attempt" to extend life*. While extending life is a very broad topic, I have many hypothesis on how it could be possible, but we'll know in 15 years if any of them test out

Games I have personally hacked successfully WITHOUT outside help:

Albatross 18 (US) (RIP) (0 bans, sold private hack)
Diablo 2 (US) (3 accounts banned, private duping method)
Dungeon Defenders (US) (Item stat modifications without grandeu)
Pangya (US/EU/SEA) (2/20 accounts banned due to detection) (Sold private hack)
Planetside 2 (US)(still not banned, been using my own esp/norecoil since alpha. Checked 4/10/13) (Take that S.O.E.) (Private hack, not for discussion/sale)
Maplestory (US) (shared private hack..between friends..free)
Warframe (US) (Private hack, not for discussion/sale)
World of Warcraft (Retail, US) (13 accounts banned for selling gold) (RIP)

Why do YOU hack?

I hack because I either dislike the company that makes the video-game (multitude of personal reasons against some game companies), or because I'm bored..and like having Infinite ammo/health/armor..I enjoy playing without people and 1 Hit KO'ing monsters..or simply running friends quickly through areas. I also enjoy playing with other hackers (at times)..just because they usually share in the same reasons that I am for hacking...and I don't have to worry as much about someone crying and reporting me..though sometimes I like to make them report me for the hilarity of them crying.

Do you share your hacks?

Not since 2012 for one reason only:

I do not want to be/feel responsible for your getting banned.
I WOULD actually feel bad if someone got banned using my hacks, and as I do not actively research coding/practice it...the quality is far below par.

The only reason I don't really get banned is because I'm a SINGLE user using MY OWN method to accomplish what I do..and even SHITTY CODING..doesn't get detected that often..when it's not used much

Do you purchase hacks or only use free ones?

Both actually!

I try to always personally type feedback to any author of a free hack I download, and encourage them to keep development..and when they stop..I personally message/email the author thanking them for their time and dedication that they put into their project. I also let them know that I understand their reasons (which I honestly do 99.9% of the time), and though they have stopped development, they will always have support from 1 person, no matter what endeavors they may have in the future.

When someone has a private hack..depending on the person's credibility, status, price, detection ratio, features..ect..if I deem it worthy, I will purchase it..ask many questions..and provide feedback.

I ask questions not to nag the author, but because I want to fully understand their reasoning on why they made the hack, what are it's limitations..and what has been patched..and what has not.

Now..I don't go asking "How do I not get banned"..because I should know by now how to not be banned..UNLESS

#1. I don't know the game that I'm going to be in..so I do not know their methods of detection.

Also..if you pay for a hack and get banned..

It's YOUR problem, deal with it. Don't go around blaming the coder, because if you're purchasing the hack..you've already committed into thinking that person is good enough to deserve your money.

If you got banned, it's because either you did something wrong, or a ton of people were using the same hack as you..and if you want to know how many people are USING the hack you are buying..you SHOULD ask.

A reputable author will never lie about how many are using his private hack, but also note..you are using a different version from the author..unless you're paying them 300++ bucks..then you're probably using their personal hack

Final note: I pay for hacks to support good authors, and because I'm too lazy to write a hack for the game myself. If there are no private hacks available, I will put in the time to write my own hack..but that takes forever with college/work. Example: Warframe..there are 3 private hacks that I know of..each one of them very different in nature, and how they interact with the game. I know the authors of the other 2 hacks..and we all play the game together on a weekly basis.

We hack to have fun, to show game companies that they aren't all that for their anti-cheats..and to ruin corrupt game economies..*cough********cough*.

Thank you if you read this gargantuan wall of text..there's no tl:dr..you either read the whole thing and appreciate it..or read parts and put back a smartass comment.

One day this might be taken out of this thread and made into a sticky if it's actually worth reading

-Wings

I created a login here a long time ago while just browsing discussions and your post was just too well written for me to not comment on. Well said, good sir, well said.

Good post.
But it applies across the entire internet world of developers, not just hacking programmers.

You mentioned its a thankless job, and a lot complaints from the end user. Well welcome to the internet! I deal with this daily on multiple android forums from people bricking their smartphones or something using my custom ROMs, when instructions are clearly laid out and I know it's 100% tested and working.

I STILL release updates to old (sometimes esoteric) projects, and create new projects, with very little thanks in return. Pay more attention to your total downloads than the thanks button, the people using it are grateful, even though they may not take the time to express it.

I've never charged for my services, and all of my source code is available online.

I however, don't insult a user for not knowing how to write code, build, compile, and debug roms. It really irks me when developers feel entitled to something when it was their own free will decision to begin coding in a public forum in the first place. If I didn't want to share my roms, I would just keep it to myself. Most developers (excluding the OP) would NEVER go and create a post saying something like "I've successfully back-ported OMX libs so HQ youtube works on our ancient phone finally, now figure it out for yourself!" There is months/years of learning to this stuff, and I don't expect the average user just googling for something already done to take up programming and learning the ins and outs of every aspect to the software/hardware in question just so he/she can hack a single game or create a phone rom.

Previous coding experience helps more than anything. It's much easier to write a book, when you can already read and speak the language. I don't expect people to learn an entire language (sometimes multiple) just to accomplish this one time task.

Moral of the story: If you have no intention of releasing a private project, keep it to yourself. And don't expect to be god of the internet if you do release something.

edit: I realize hacking games are just exploits and work-arounds that can sometimes be easily patched once discovered by developers. But this is the nature of game hacking. Nico, Maddoggy, and the other devs all know that once released, the hack will eventually be patched. The difference is having the drive to continue to create methods that achieve similar results once the older hack is patched. I understand if you are programming for yourself and finally got something to work that you don't want to release it, but your personal private hack should stay that way. Personal, and private. It does nobody any good knowing you have it. We all know that no game is hack proof, and there are probably hundred of possibilities to achieving working undetected hacks on vindictus, and the OP posting that he finally figured out one of those methods doesn't change anything for the community.

I figured out way more than one method, and the am of the topic was: hey, i'm a new guy, i've found some exploits, it's not as hard as you think you guys should try it out on your own!

instead i get: your an asshole, screw you..your shits fake, *wha wha wha*.

excuse me if i dare to disclose what i've done and that anyone with a bit of drive can do it...sorry =)

True but the problem is that this thread lived too long (sorry for extending its life )

I see, let's us examine that in detail shall we?

okay sounds good

no "it's not as hard as you think" nor "you guys should try it out on your own" yet

very informative

thanks for the information

A lot of us would agree, but this is neither informative nor encouraging

Impressive, but color me skeptical.

"even Nico only got told "little" about it, you leechers have next to no chance" is what I'm getting from this one

Showing your superiority off?

yup, that is all. Nothing on the exploit itself nor "you guys should try it out on your own" here. Unless, of course, you were expecting us to match your superior intelligence and interpret as such from that post. If that is the case, sorry, we don't get it.

You haven't disclosed anything. We've always known vindictus hacking is possible (and always will be). But just saying, "i has hax and you guyz are stupid" isn't exactly disclosing information to the community. And no, I'm not asking for your work, I have my own, thanks.

i disclosed that it was possible, i guess gone are the day's that people help them selves.

Well, I've been out of it for a while, but it used to be that Nexon didn't really patch but maybe twice a year. And when it did it was a lame attempt at a patch that was quickly cracked. Every other time they really just detect the hack itself. So making a undetected hack really isn't all that big of a deal in the short run. Making the hack is the easy part. Once you release it, Nexon will just annoy us hackers by detecting our hack, they don't patch the vulnerable code, they just look for our hack hanging around. So, by not releasing we protect our hacks. Because, damn it, we want to use them too.

So having a patched or unpatched hack doesn't really speak to any particular skill. It speaks to the presence (or lack) of laziness on Nexon's part.

Not to say that we don't want to give them away, but the truth is, I've never released a hack unless I had at least two ways to do something. There are some hacks that boggle the imagination and turn you into super-mega-god-all-powerful. These hacks will stay buried for all of time. There is more out there than most know about.

So, to release or not release... Honestly, releasing is annoying. Nexon is annoying. It's not that we can't beat them, we can, we have. Oh god, did we ever beat them. The problem wasn't my console or every other console before or since. The problem is that Nexon detected it. My hack still worked, it just got detected. Do you know how boring it get to write the same code 10 different ways to change it's signature?

The question is, was it worth it? I dunno. I certainly didn't get very much money. Many people showed their gratitude. Many people didn't. Why do we release hacks? So do you really want to know why we do this? Do you really want to know why we hack?

Because we can.

Because it was a challenge (honestly, the reason I made MHWalker so so I could piss off some Dragono girl that I didn't like who had a different bot program called SinBot, I made a console because I had never made a console before).

Nexon will never be safe for me, or @Nico, or @helldemon, even @Pie. You want hacks? If I'm interested in doing so then I will. If I'm not then I won't. Very little anyone can do to change my mind because I don't write hacks for you... I write them for me. And that, ladies and gentlemen is the truth.

l2